Archive for the ‘historiography’ Category

After the bones of “doubting Thomas,” now, we have “Skulls of doubtful Thomas” everywhere!

May 10, 2018

After the bones of “doubting Thomas,” now, we have “Skulls of doubtful Thomas” everywhere!

Tombs of Thomas in different countries

The Christian myths, manufacture of relics and fabrication of evidences excel science and technology: Even though Vincet Smith asserted, “Even Apostle can die but for once,” the “Thomas myth” does not die with one body, one skull, one skeleton and so on! Defeating the mathematical progression, they have been increasing day by day in all continents, countries and counties. Yet, from the Pope to Pastor, they enjoy the “myths of Jesus, Christ, Jesus Christ” and so on along with Mary’s girdle, milk etc., without any blush, shame or embarrassment. The “mythical Thomas” could have travelled all over the globe, dying many times, leaving skeletons, skulls and bones everywhere, so that they could be collected, kept in Churches and venerated faithfully. The biology, bio-technology, genetics, cloning, and other sciences have to take alms from them. Ironically, the Indian academicia[1] and journalists[2] have been also aiding and abetting in promoting such myths, frauds and criminal acts without any shame.  Though, the discourse about “Scientific and secular methodology” and “scientific temple” and all, they do not wok here.

The finger of claimed to be of Thomas is kept in Church in Rome.

Praying before skeletons and bones – the Indian and Italian ways: The bones and skulls of “Doubting and doubting Thomas” provoke people all over the world. Ivarfjeld[3], pointed out the curious practices followed by the Catholic Christians as follows, “On December 2009 this Catholic priest in Italy bowed and prayed before a box which contain the claimed skeleton of Thomas the Apostle of Jesus. The priest pray to a skeleton in a box inside the altar at the Basilica of St. Thomas in Ortona, Italy (how they pray kneeling down). The photos taken on feast of Saint Thomas the Apostle, December 21, 2009. The most amazing parts of this picture is not that a Roman Catholic priest bow and pray in front of a relic box. But rather that the relic box includes a skeleton, whom the Vatican claim is of “St. Thomas the Apostle”.

Bust of the Apostle St Thomas in the Basilica in Ortona church

Doubting Thomas has tombs everywhere!: Ivarfjeld continues[4], “Take a look at the remains, kept inside the box inside this claimed to be a “Church in Italy” (colour photo of Ortona skull). The skeleton displayed on an Indian website (pointing to the photo, with keft-right orientation changed). To avoid people accusing me of faking this skeleton photo, this is the link to the publisher[5]: We have to thank Catholic bloggers for exposing such acts of wickedness[6]. It is hardly possible to bow deeper than this is front of bones (as such practice was not allowed). The Portuguese opened a Tomb of “St. Thomas” in Kerala in 1523 A.D.  So this “saint” had two Catholic tombs at the same time. One of them in Italy. The problem with “good old skeletons” is that they are difficult to identify. In particular skeletons that was picked up in India.  In India “St. Thomas” has at lest three claimed burial sites”.

Bust of the Apostle St Thomas in the Basilica in Ortona church.two models

The worship of corpses, skulls and bones within the Roman Catholic religion Ivarfjeld explains, “This is what a well known Roman Catholic blogger has recorded, “ This is the tomb of Saint Thomas the Apostle located in the little town of Ortona in the Abruzzi.  Thomas was transfixed with spears and martyred in about 68-72 in the south of India, in Mylapore (Mylapour), a suburb of Madras.  Before that he preached the Gospel to the Parthians, Medes, Persians and Hyrcanians before he arrived in India.  By order of the king he was killed and his remains were later brought to Edessa in Mesopotamia and then here to Ortona in the year 1258”. Source: Blogger (link not displayed). My comment: The Roman Catholic Church is an amazing collector of corpses, skulls and bones. And even whole skeletons, which later has been cut into pieces, and sold as relics. I am honored, that my Lord and God can use me to expose all this, so that the eyes of the blind might be opened. Luke 8:17, “For there is nothing hidden that will not be disclosed, and nothing concealed that will not be known or brought out into the open”. I do not know any other websites with such a collection of articles that expose worship of corpses, skulls and bones within the Roman Catholic religion”.

Thomas skeleton fake- photos are faked

Manufacture of Thomas relics and myths: Ivarfjeld concluded as follows, In the example of Thomas the Apostle, his bones are kept in several location in Italy, and also in India. His rather fragmented skeleton in the little town of Ortona in Italy. A finger in Basilica di Santa Croce in Gerusalemme in Rome. The right arm is kept for display in The Marthoma Pontifical Shrine in Thrissur in Kerala in India. Which was claimed to be the site of his tomb already in 1523 A.D. The finger of claimed to be of Thomas is kept in Church in Rome (photo). The Greek Orthodox church claim this is the skull of Apostles Thomas held at Pathmos (photo). The right hand of claimed to be Thomas is kept in Thrissur in Kerala since 1953 (photo). His full skull is also claimed to be kept in Monastery of St. John the Theologian, Patmos in Greece. If you buy all this fraud, there is basically nothing I can do to help you. You live in such a bondage to the Papacy, that you will not repent regardless of what scandals and insanity that will be reported from within this movement. The example of claimed to be the Apostle Thomas is grim. The “saint” has two Roman Catholic tombs. One in India and one in Italy. The Portuguese and the Italian seems not to have coordinated their religious claims. Fraud is the only suitable word for this. Jesus the Messiah is alive. He will show mercy to all who repent, and are willing to renounce this systematically invented evil”.

Thomas skull fraud- Pathmos, St George, Greece

St. Thoma skull at the church in Navestock, Essex, UK: Robert Richard Tighe and Jamed Edward Davis recorded as follows[7]: “The relics inclosed in some of them comprised –

  1. a portion of the milk of the Virgin Mary,
  2. parts of the skulls of St. Bartholomew and
  3. parts of the skulls of St. Thomas the Apostle.
  4. Tables and branches of silver and silver gilt stood on the high altar, one of the branches containing an arm-bone of St. William of York (” which can be seen”), and another, part of an arm of St. George.
  5. The relics not inclosed comprised –
  6. an arm-bone of St. Osytho,
  7. an arm-bone of St- Richard, and
  8. bones of St. Margaret Queen of Scotland,
    1. Thomas of Hereford,
    2. David,
    3. William of England, and
    4. William of York;
  9. part of the jaw-bone of St. Mark, containing fourteen teeth;
  10. a bone of St. Gerard,
  11. a rib of one of the eleven thousand virgins,
  12. bones of St. Maurice and St. Elizabeth,
  13. a rib of St. Vitale,
  14. part of the brain of St. Eustace; and
  15. in a separate division were –
    1. a bone of St. George,
    2. parts of the Lord’s supper table and
    3. of the Virgin Mary’s tomb, and
    4. some of St. Thomas of Canterbury’s blood.
  16. There was also one of the stones with which good Stephen was stoned,
  17. a breast-bone of the good Archbishop Edmund,
  18. a shirt of St. Thomas the Martyr,
  19. a white girdle given by St. John the Evangelist to St. Mary, and
  20. a small part of the skull of St. Thomas the Apostle, and
  21. a candle end of the Virgin Mary.”

Here, “parts of the skulls of St. Thomas the Apostle” and “a small part of the skull of St. Thomas the Apostle”,  are interestng and intriguing, ad they are appearing again and again and everywhere.

St. Thomas the Apostle in Navestock, Essex, UK

St. Thoma skull at the church in Navestock, Essex, UK: The details given are reproduced as follows[8]: “St. Thomas the Apostle in Navestock, Essex, is an example of a church which should not have survived the Second World War. One night in 1940 a Luftwaffe parachute ‘landmine’ [a sea mine deliberately dropped on land as a high capacity blast bomb] floated down out of the night sky and exploded in the churchyard just a few feet from the church. The powerful blast ripped right through the building destroying all but four tiny fragments of the church’s stained glass and seriously damaging the spire and roof. The then vicar, Rev George Bishop, managed to arrange for tarpaulins and other temporary roofing during the war years but major repairs were not completed until 1954. The shallow blast crater left by the landmine remains in the churchyard next to the path and is, today, marked by a sundial. Navestock is an imposing church of 11th and 12th century date but which was largely rebuilt in the 13th and 14th centuries including the addition of the prominent timber belfry tower. The tower has been radio-carbon dated to 1120AD to 1240AD. This tower is constructed of four inclined posts stabilised with long passing braces which are jointed with ‘archaic lap joints’. The present bells date back to the early 15th century. The church’s massive organ was a gift from a private house but was moved to its present postion in 1954 when an upper gallery was demolished as part of the post-war renovation[9]. Internally the church has a nave and chancel with a south aisle – the aisle being built about the same time as the belfry tower and on the same alignment. The aisle is divided from the nave by a series of ‘stone’ arches which are not stone at all. As revealed nearer to the chancel, the arches are actually wooden structures which were plastered over to resemble stone. A detail photograph elsewhere in this set shows the method that was used to achieve this. Internally there are numerous monuments dating back to the 1600s, many for the Waldegrave family who were prominent local landowners”.

© Vedaprakash

07-05-2018

St. Thomas the Apostle in Navestock, Essex, UK-2

[1] In the so-called History congress conferences, they encourage papers on spreading such myths. Particularly, the academicia of Kerala aid, abet and promte such myths.

[2] They carry out such myths, very often, along with history, tourism and so on, kowingly, as they are Christians, crypto-Christians or promoted by Christians.

[3]  Ivarfjeld, Praying before a box with a skeleton named “St.Thomas”, FEBRUARY 2, 2013.

[4] https://ivarfjeld.com/2013/02/02/bowing-and-praying-before-a-box-with-a-skeleton/

[5] Referring to Iswar Sharan blog

[6] Perhaps, he mistook “Ishwar Sharan” as one of such “Catholic” bloggers!

  1. parts of the skulls of St. Thomas the Apostle.

Green…, London,1858,  p. 232

[8] https://www.flickr.com/photos/barryslemmings/250395628/

[9] www.flickr.com/photos/barryslemmings/sets/72157594296068311/is the full set for Navestock church.

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“Thomas myth” raked up by the Kerala Church to suppress the multi-crore land scam racist, liturgical and  catechetical problems (2)

April 17, 2018

“Thomas myth” raked up by the Kerala Church to suppress the multi-crore land scam racist, liturgical and  catechetical problems (2)

Discussing Thomas myth- Thelakkat and Narayanan

G. S. Narayanan pointed out that Kerala was not habituated during first centuries: Noted historian M G S Narayanan said there were no historic documents to suggest that St Thomas had come to India for evangelisation work[1]. “There were no human habitations here at that time in Kerala. There was only forest here. How would he visit such a place? For what? . Human settlements began towards the end of Mauryan dynasty, he said. It is common for religious heads and political parties to twist history for their benefit, he told a Malayalam TV channel. The Syrian Christian community in Kerala believes that St Thomas came to this part in AD 52 and had established churches. The community considers St Thomas as the ‘Father in Faith’ of Christians in India. The Syro-Malabar Church has over 30 dioceses in the country and four outside– in the U.S.A., Canada, Australia and Britain–serving over five million faithful. M.G.S. Narayanan had earlier questioned the claim[2]. “Thomashleeha (as St. Thomas is known in Kerala) is an imaginary thing. He is one of the apostles. He should be Christ’s contemporary. If he had come to Kerala, there would have been only forests in Kerala, let alone Brahmins,” Narayanan told Outlook. “Syrian Christians’ trade relations with Kerala started in 2nd and 3rd century. Brahmins came as a hegemonic community in Kerala only in 8th Century,” he said. Pius Melekandathil, professor at the Centre for Historical Studies, Jawaharlal Nehru University (JNU), who is an expert on maritime history and church history, admitted that it is a matter of dispute however saying that the probability factor has to be taken into consideration.

Geevargheese Mor Cooilos denies Brahmins were converted by Thomas
The Bishop, Geevarghese Mor Coorilos asserted that Thomas never converted Brahmins[3]: The Bishop of Niranam diocese, historically one of the oldest dioceses of the Jacobite Syrian Christian Church in Kerala, has criticized the upper caste tendencies among believers fuelled by a “mythical” belief that St. Thomas converted Brahmins to Christianity in Kerala[4]. It is also widely believed that St Thomas, one of the 12 apostles of Christ, had converted members of top Brahmin families in Kerala to Christianity. Though the Abrahamic faith is devoid of caste hierarchies, Christian families often hold get-togethers to celebrate their lineage and put out books proclaiming their Brahmin origin[5].  The Bishop, Geevarghese Mor Coorilos, however, in a Facebook post announced[6] that he would not attend any such get-togethers, dubbing them as “programs to assert their artificially created upper caste identity and lineage.” “They say their ancestors were Brahmins converted by St. Thomas. They even put out their family history in books proclaiming such false notions. These baseless, savarna caste-oriented and reactionary myths have to be busted,” read his statement in Malayalam, adding, “I did attend such events due to my personal intimacy with them. But, I regret it. I can’t (do it) any more”.

Geevarghese Mor Coorilos asserts that Brahmins not converted by Thomas

Supporting Brahmin or Dalit – the Church divided: “It is a matter of debate. But, many historians have seen it as highly probable and reliable. The earliest reference to St. Thomas preaching gospel to Brahmins is from St. Jerome of 4th century. Among the converts , the Brahmin converts seem to have been quite significant enough to attract the special attention of St. Jerome, who mentions that the apostle went “ut Christus apud Brachmanas praedicaret” (to preach Christ to the Brahmins),” he said. “This needs more investigation. It is more nuanced and complex. Brahmin does not mean one single category of social group. There were different categories of Brahmins in Kerala. It was not a period where there was absence of Brahmins. It’s true they came as a hegemonic group only in 8th Century. But, there were Brahmins as scattered and fragmented community even before that. Duties and obligations of Brahmins under Chera empire are mentioned in Sangam literature,” he said. Melekandathil also said that there are written documents of maritime trade agreement between Muziris (in Kerala) and Alexandria from 2nd century obtained from Vienna archive in 1985. The Bishop, who also serves the World Council of Churches as moderator of its Commission on World Mission and Evangelism (CWME), later added, “Many address me as ‘Thirumeni’, a myth created by the upper caste[7]. They can call me a friend or father. If they want it to be formal, it can be Bishop. We have to change and should change many things,” To make his point, the Bishop quoted writer OV Vijayan’s statement “The English language is the best weapon to challenge the caste”.  He had also supported the hartal organised by Dalit outfits on 09-04-2018, Monday. “Normally, I do not support hartals as such protests in Kerala have not served their purpose. But I support the Dalit hartal wholeheartedly as it is against the atrocities faced by the marginalised sections under the fascist and feudal system. The people who are opposing the strike should introspect over their approach and mentality to the caste system and Dalits,” he posted on Facebook[8].

SC- converted christians- controversy

Catholic drama of caste, casteism and savarna: Fr. Paul Thelakat, former Syro Malabar Church spokesperson, echoed Coorilose’s statement. “In India we have bane that we irrespective of our religion have Manu sleeping within our consciousness. Everyone wants to establish one’s own upper caste glory. It is found in the ancient Christians of Kerala e.g certain families claiming to have been baptised from Brahmin families by St Thomas himself. St Thomas is supposed to have come to Kerala, it would be in the first century. Brahmins came to south India only in the 8th century. I am sorry to say upper caste mentality can be found also in Marxists in Kerala. Even though Marxism has a universal humanistic ideology, we find the upper caste surname kept, like Nampoodirpad, Menon, Pillai, Nair etc,” he said. Firm on his position despite the sharp and mixed reactions to his statement, Coorilos later wrote on the same post: “I am adding this after reading many comments to this post. Many of you are calling me ‘Thirumeni’ (a feudal honorific). That’s also a product of the savarna consciousness. You can call me a friend or Father. Or, if you want to make it more formal, you can call me Bishop.” “(Writer) OV Vijayan had said that English is the best weapon to resist caste. We must change. Change is must,” he said.

Church corrects Thelekkat - MM- 15-04-2018

Rs 80 crores land sold for Rs 27.30 crore: Just like Vatican, the Indian Church has also been involved in many scandals from sex to money swindling and other activities. Particularly, from Kerala, the crimes related to the Church have been horrible from murder, sex and financial scams involving all types of priests, bishops and cardinals also. Pressure is mounting on Cardinal George Alencherry, head of the Syro-Malabar Catholic Church based in Kerala, to resign after allegations that church land had been sold below market value in a deal that he had approved. Alencherry, 72, was ordained as a Cardinal, a priest of the highest rank in the Roman Catholic Church, by Pope Benedict XVI in February 2012. He is one of only five Cardinals in India. The deal in question concerns the sale of three acres of land in Kochi by the Ernakulam archdiocese in 2016 to repay a Rs 60-crore bank loan it had taken to build a medical college. The agent appointed by the church to conduct the deal had estimated the value of the land at Rs 27.30 crore, but the church has so far received only Rs 9.13 crore of that amount. However, priests and lay people critical of the action claim that the plot was actually worth at least Rs 80 crores However, Kerala Catholic Bishops Council (KCBC) doesn’t seemed to be amused over the controversy. “There is no need to discuss the issue now. Those who raised the issue should solve it,” said KCBC official spokesperson Fr Varghese Vallikkatt[9]. But church sources pointed that Fr Thelakkat’s statement was made in connection with the ongoing land controversy in the Eranakulam-Angamali archdiocese and the tiff between the Ernakulam-Angamali diocese and the Changanacherry archdiocese respectively[10].

© Vedaprakash

17-04-2018

CPM organises 'BEEF FESTIVAL' inaugurated by 'Fr' Paul Thelakkat. Reported with glee by 'THE HINDU'.

[1] Covai Post Network, Historian Narayanan rubbishes St Thomas’s visit to Kerala to convert Hindus, April 15, 2018.

[2] https://www.covaipost.com/kerala-news/historian-narayanan-rubbishes-st-thomass-visit-to-kerala-to-convert-hindus/

[3] Indian express, Kerala Jacobite Church Metropolitan Geevarghese Mor Coorilos fires salvo at faithful’s ‘false beliefs’, By Express News Service | Published: 10th April 2018 03:24 AM, Last Updated: 10th April 2018 03:24 AM

[4] http://www.newindianexpress.com/states/kerala/2018/apr/10/kerala-jacobite-church-metropolitan-geevarghese-mor-coorilos-fires-salvo-at-faithfuls-false-belief-1799309.html

[5] Outlook, Bishop Demolishes The Biggest Conversion ‘Myth’ of Kerala , 13 APRIL 2018 Last Updated at 5:21 PM.

[6] https://www.outlookindia.com/website/story/bishop-demolishes-the-biggest-conversion-myth-of-kerala/310974

[7] News.18, Histories of Old Christian Families in Kerala ‘Fabricated’, Chandrakanth Viswanath | News18Updated:April 10, 2018, 11:45 PM IST.

[8] https://www.news18.com/news/india/kerala-syrian-church-bishop-calls-histories-of-old-christian-families-in-kerala-fabricated-1714533.html

[9] Times of India, Fresh row in church over St Thomas’s ‘visit’ to Kerala, TNN | Apr 13, 2018, 10:50 IST

[10] https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/kochi/fresh-row-in-church-over-st-thomass-visit-to-kerala/articleshow/63742878.cms

 

“Thomas myth” raked up by the Kerala Church to suppress the multi-crore land scam racist, liturgical and  catechetical problems (1)

April 17, 2018

“Thomas myth” raked up by the Kerala Church to suppress the multi-crore land scam racist, liturgical and  catechetical problems (1)

Saint Thomas myth book - Tamil and English

Why “Thomas myth” raises head then and there?: Definitely, 120 or 130 crores of Indians, hardly few lakhs would be worried about the myth, fable, legend, story, tale, parable etc., about Thomas, doubting Thomas, doubtful Thomas or saint Thomas of any category, character or thing. However, the fanatic Christians, in spite of unhistorical nature, then and there used to repeat like parrot, “St. Thomas visited India”! Even, I  did not know anything about this. However, when the nuisance interfered with academic curriculum of the schools, I brought out a book “Saint Thomas myth in India” in 1989[1], exposing the useless, utter nonsense and unhistorical narratives spread not in accordance with history or with historical analysis. Ishwar Sharan brought out “Mylapore Siva Temple and Myth of Saint Thomas” in 1991[2] and 2010[3] [these books can be downloaded from the links provided at the footnotes]. As 90% of Indians have been secular, they do not bother about such myths, as they are concerned about their livelihood, attending to family affairs and other important work. Yet, the Christians used to disturb them with the fairy tales. So now, in 2018, the myth has started exploding again for unknown reasons. First, the rivalry among the “Thomas church” groups was reported, later turning into multi-crore land scam involving cardinal, bishops, and other Christian priests. As Indians used to think, “It is all their internal affair,” they read, heard and ignored the news and reports. But, the Christians want to draw attention of others. So the myth-debate has started.

Attack on Chidananda sami and promoting Ghulam Ali

Attack on Hindus, Hindu religion etc: Unlike other states, in Kerala, not only, the Hindu population is less, but, also, Hindus are targeted by the dominant, Communist, Mohammedan and Christian forces by many means. Now, everything is viewed in political perspective as 2019 General elections are nearing. Moreover, in Kerala, the power has gone to the Communists from the Congress.

Religion Population %
Hindus 1,82,82,492 54.73
Muslims 88,73,472 26.56
Christians 61,41,269 18.38

Evidently, the 55% Hindu population has been divided mainly by communist ideology and secularist principles followed and of course, the caste division of the Hindus. However, the slogan “Congress-mukt Bharat” has caught up the educated elite of the Keralites and some of them have started drifting towards BJP, mainly because of the charismatic leadership of Modi. Even Congress leaders like Shashi Tharoor have appreciated Modi. The Christian clergy has been having dialogue with RSS cadre. However, the uncompromising Marxists and Mohammedans have been fighting with right-wing groups in Kerala, many times leading to violence. Under such circumstances, the Church in Kerala might resort to strategy to target Hindus under the guise of raking up “Brahmin-SC/Dalit” issue under the bogey of “thomas myth,” as that serves them in many ways.

Church refutes -corrects Thelekkat - Mathru Bhumi- 15-04-2018

The Syro-Malabar Church issued statement refuting Fr Paul Thelakkat who reportedly declared that “st Thomas never came to India”: The “Thomas-myth” has been the worst type of falsified Christian propaganda circulated in India, in spite of historians making tall claims about “secular history, “secular temper” to deal with history and all. Perhaps, in recent times, it has come out in the media. Amid a controversy triggered by reported remarks of a senior priest questioning the belief that St Thomas visited India in AD 52[4], the Syro-Malabar Church today said the disciple of Jesus Christ did visit India[5]. “The official stand of the Syro-Malabar Church is that St Thomas had visited India”, the Church said in a statement here[6]. The statement was issued after Fr Paul Thelakkat, a former spokesperson of the church, last week [08-04-2018, Sunday] reportedly said there was no evidence to suggest that St Thomas had come to India[7]. Some newspapers and TV news channels quoting former spokesperson of the Syro Malabar Church had reported there is no evidence to prove St Thomas had come to India[8]. Some media even said this is the official stand of Syro-Malabar Church. “This is baseless…,” it said. The Syro-Malabar Church originated from the evangelisation works of St Thomas, said the statement issued by Bishop Sebastian Vaniyappurackal[9]. “World famous historians have accepted it as a fact. Many historic documents are there to support this,” he said. The “Business Standard” carried the story with caution[10]. The propagandist church however did not name such “World famous historians”!

Fr Thelakkad Denies Saying That St Thomas Did not Visit Kerala, Mathrubhumi
Fr Thelakkat clarifies that he never questioned the belief of his coming but converting Brahmins: Evidently perturbed by the Church attack, Fr Thelakkat today [15-04-2018] said he had never made a statement about the traditional belief that St Thomas had come to India. He clarified he had made certain remarks regarding prevailing upper caste feelings in Church while joining a debate kick started by Bishop Geevarghese Mor Coorilos of the Niranam diocese of the Jacobite Syrian Church on the issue. After all, Catholic priest cannot go against the hierarchy, Pope and the Vatican. “We should not rely on glory of a caste or tribe. That is dangerous,” Thelakkat told PTI. The Jacobite priest had recently criticised some church members for conducting hollow family meetings. He had said in a Facebook post that some of the families believe in fake myths that their forefathers were members of the Brahmin community and St Thomas converted them to Christianity. These kinds of false beliefs should be broken, he had said. Whether Brahmins were or not, the motive behind such belief, the drama of opposing and supporting myth etc., in the context has to be analysed.

SC- converted christians- controversy

Christians cannot fool, hoodwink or suppress Indians for their denominations existing for their ow reasons: Syrian Christians are divided mainly into Syrian Catholic, Jacobite, Orthodox, Marthoma churches depending upon whether they owe their allegiance to the Pope in Rome, the Patriarch in Antioch, Catholicos in Kerala’s Kottayam or Metropolita in Thiruvalla. In other words, it is their theological, liturgical, catechetical problem as to how they have been divided or to be divided. They just want to provoke Hindus by raising the casteist issue to suppress their racist and denominational divisions. Coorilos, who belongs to Jacobite Church, has mercilessly swung an axe at the root of the age-old belief that is pervasive across all the four sects – that their ancestors are Namboodiris who were converted to Christianity by St Thomas. It also questions the existence of churches like Malayatoor that is famously believed to be the meditative halt of St Thomas during his Kerala leg of his sojourn. Brahmins’ conversion to Christianity under St. Thomas had been a point of dispute for long. .

The Papal bull Gregory VX accommmodating caste

Caste and Christianity – Pope’s tactful accommodation: The Pope Gregory XV (1621-23) has definitely accepted the caste. The Bull of Pope Gregory XV, “Bulla Romanae Sedis Antistitis”, dated 31 January 1623, accedes to the requests of the missionaries to accommodate themselves to certain caste practices and usages of the new converts[11]. Why not then the present Pope annul the Papal Bull issued, instead of recollecting what he had said in 1986. In fact, after his visit, there had been so many “caste problems and issues” within the Indian Church. The Supreme Court itself pronounced that if the Chuch wants reservation based on untouchability and caste, such factors of existence in Christianity should be proven (Soosai vs UOI – AIR 1986). Then, started the research of Athony Raj, SJ with funds to prove that untouchability and Caste system were there in Christianity and practiced even today. The Dutch Reformed Church of South Africa (DRC) has separate Churches for whites, black and coloured ones. The Apartheid Enquiry Committee in its report clearly pointed out that the Bible was responsible for caste like division. Why then even in non-Indian societies such divisions should exist?

© Vedaprakash

17-04-2018

caste, christianity, SC- reservation

[1] The Tamil book, book “Saint Thomas myth in India” – can be downloaded from here –https://onedrive.live.com/?authkey=%21AE9JnTvwIEO8PVc&cid=F97FE5FFAA8BA3D6&id=F97FE5FFAA8BA3D6%21144&parId=F97FE5FFAA8BA3D6%211423&o=OneUp

[2]  Ishwar Sharan’’s “Mylapore Siva Temple and Myth of Saint Thomas” 1991 edition can be downloaded from here – https://onedrive.live.com/?authkey=%21AFZpdl8nyZY-SGE&cid=F97FE5FFAA8BA3D6&id=F97FE5FFAA8BA3D6%211429&parId=F97FE5FFAA8BA3D6%211423&o=OneUp

[3]Ishwar Sharan’’s “Mylapore Siva Temple and Myth of Saint Thomas” 2010 edition can be downloaded from here –https://onedrive.live.com/?authkey=%21APmNJmffAGILUmY&cid=F97FE5FFAA8BA3D6&id=F97FE5FFAA8BA3D6%21154&parId=F97FE5FFAA8BA3D6%211423&o=OneUp

[4] Note in spite of the fact that CE and BCE notations are used by  historians and researchers, the media persons still use the “christian” notations!

[5] Malayala Manorma, Church corrects Fr Thelekkatt, says there is proof of St Thomas visiting India, Sunday April 2018 08:28 PM IST.

[6] https://english.manoramaonline.com/news/kerala/2018/04/15/st-thomas-church-india.html

[7] Mathrubhumi, Syro-Malabar Church refutes Fr.Paul Thelakkat’s remark on St. Thomas’ India visit.,, Published: Apr 15, 2018, 02:27 PM IST……

[8] http://english.mathrubhumi.com/news/kerala/syro-malabar-church-refutes-fr-paul-thelakkat-s-remark-on-st-thomas-india-visit-1.2744403

[9] Business Standard, Church says St Thomas visited India, Press Trust of India | Kochi, Last Updated at April 15, 2018 19:35 IST; First Published: Sun, April 15 2018. 19:35 IST.

[10] This is the appened warning: (This story has not been edited by Business Standard staff and is auto-generated from a syndicated feed.)

http://www.business-standard.com/article/pti-stories/church-says-st-thomas-visited-india-118041500554_1.html

[11] http://hindooraashtrcom.fatcow.com/pdf/Caste-in-Christianity-Papal-Bull.pdf

Black magic, transfer of spirit and all sorceries carried on in the Land of Dravidanadu, where Periyar was born (1)

March 28, 2017

Black magic, transfer of spirit and all sorceries carried on in the Land of Dravidanadu, where Periyar was born (1)

 lord-sri-rama-1971-dk-chappal-garlanded

The Dravidian totalitarian and rationalistic rule during 1960-70s: In Tamilnadu, the Dravidian politicians used to claim about their “rational atheism”, “analytical wisdom” and so on, but in actual life, most of them have been God-believers worshipping God stealthily or by proxy i.e., through their mothers, wives, sisters and daughters. Some of them used to worship gods stealthily in their houses also with puja rooms. However, they say that “I am an atheist, but, I do not interfere with the belief of our family members”. How then, they could interfere with belief of crores of people of Tamilnadu? In public and platform, they pour abuses with the worst filthy language on Hindu religion, Gods and Goddesses and practices that no woman could bear. Yet, they have earned the titles of “Periyar” [big / great person among others or all], “Aringnar” [the only person who knows all], “Kalainjar” [the person who has been expert in all arts / subjects] and so on! Thus, the superiority complex that has been working in their mind set, makes others always to listen to them, accept what they say and none should or could ask any question. During the 1960s, if anybody would question them would be thrashed down.

 DK celebrated Ravana Leela in 1974

During the LPG regime / Internet age, questioning started: This is the way, they have been reigning supreme for the last 60 years. Only their views made public and circulated authoritatively[1]. However, when, internet came, the people started understanding their ambiguous dogma, hollow philosophy and dubious ideology of these groups. The youngsters could easily understand their selective, biased and pre-conceived propaganda carried against one particular religion i.e, Hindu religion[2]. As a ruler, the Dravidian or atheist Chief Minister has to administer and perform his duties as per the Constitutional and other statutory provisions treating all believers. However, in the case of Hindu religion, temples, temple administration, lease and rental of temple and mutt properties, conduct of rituals, rites and ceremonies, they interfered and spoiled many times. Though, the recent past is suppressed, the beating of Rama with chappals and other incidences make the youngsters to realize the duplicity of the Dravidian protagonists. The ganging up of splinter groups of Communists, anti-Hindu ideologists, particularly the Christian and Muslim groups joining them raise questions and they have understood that it is only anti-Hindu and secular or “Paguttaravi”, as being claimed. Under such circumstances, the recent happenings in Tamilnadu exposes their another ugly face of them.

 DK celebrated Ravana Leela in 1974- burned

Annadurai suddely died in 1969: C. N. Annadurai from high caste Mudaliar community was in power during the period 1967 – 1969. However, he fell ill due to excessive usage of tobacco substances. In September 1968 Annadurai went to New York for medical treatment and admitted in the hospital. After diagnosis, it was found out that there was malignant growth in his gullet and hence he was operated for Cancer in the gullet at the Memorial Sloan–Kettering Cancer Center. He returned to Chennai in November 1968 and continued to address several official functions against medical advice. His health deteriorated further and he died suddenly on 3 February 1969 within three months returning from USA after sugery and treatment. His cancer was attributed to his habit of chewing tobacco. However, some of the family members doubted about his sudden death. When Karunanidhi immediately took over as CM, people resented about his haste action.  They questioned why the senior pontiff Sri Chandrasekhara Saraswati of Kanchi Mutt wore spectacles as to why God could not have rectified his eyesight without glasses. But, here, none questioned as to why the science allowed man to die in that way in spite of the treatment etc. Later, MGR was also subjected to similar conditions. M. R. Radha attempted to kill MGR (on January 12, 1967), of course, he was not in power. After becoming CM, he was also not having proper health (in 1983 kidney problem developed), admitted to Brooklyn hospital US, returned after kidney transplant on February 4, 1985, but had to get treatment again and again in US and died on December 24, 1987.

Fire walk by the DK

Dravidian brand of astrologers, predictors and magicians: When the DMK came to power, the first thing, they did was to legalize the marriages performed under the “Pakuthtarivi” / “Suyamariyadhai” categories, as such marriages were held null and void in the courts. The rationalism did not work with the scientific judiciary system. Thus, they became cautious in dealing with social issues. The Dravidian politicias have been interested in astrology, auspicious time and date, black magic and all sorts of such superstitious practices, irrational rites and credulous rituals. Though, they denounce everything in public, in private, they practiced and hence their brand of Dravidian astrologers, predicting experts and magicians have been developed in due course and they have to keep the secrets in person, not to tell anybody in public and carry on their business, to safeguard their interests. That is why Karunanidhi used to hesitate to enter the Brahadheswarar temple, but wear yellow shwal as per the advice of his “asthana jyodhidar”, court / personal astrologer. Under such circumstances, the current events are to be analyzed.

Dravida fire-pot imitating

The antics, gimmicks and counter-rituals of of Dravida Kazhagam and allied groups: The Dravidar Kazhagam used to play gimmicks by imitating the  ritual of coconut breaking, fasting during eclipses, firewalk, carrying pots of burning coal, spiking one’s tongue and body with iron hooks, the concept of auspicious time, astrology, palm reading etc[3]. Though, they used to criticize only Hindu religion for the so-called “ritualism”[4], they close eyes, when they themselves follow such “ritualistic” practices, i.e, respecting the statues of EVR, Maniammai, celebrating birth and death days, garlanding and showering the idols with flowers. However, they never reenact the “crucifixion” of the Christians and bleeding beatings of “Shia Muslims” exposing their hypocrisy. Again, when Jayalalita was in hospital, the followers carried on all devoted rituals and rites praying all gods to save her. Incidentally, they were carried on in the most “secular” way, in the sense, Christians and Muslims have also participated. Therefore, tactfully, the DK groups kept silence to prove their ideology!

Was black magiv involved inn the death of Amma

Was Jayalalita died because of black magic?: The Daily Mail, UK carried a news item as follows[5]: “A leading astro guru in Chennai has said that Tamil Nadu chief minister J Jayalalithaa is a victim of black magic which has left her hospitalised since September, 2017. Not willing to identify himself for security reasons, the spiritual guru said Jayalalithaa has suffered from bad health because she has too many rivals. “It’s not just people from the rival party (DMK) who have spent huge money on tantriks to damage Jayalalithaa’s health. “I have no hesitation in saying that she has detractors even within her own party (AIADMK) who wanted to see her suffer,” he said. News on the health condition of Jayalalithaa is being kept a top secret. She is admitted in Apollo hospital in Chennai. Apart from a team of in-house specialists, doctors from the AIIMS New Delhi and a critical care specialist from London, are also involved in ensuring the CM is now stable. The astro guru also said it was quite possible Jayalalithaa’s arch rival M Karunanidhi could also be suffering from bad health due to tantrik spells. “Rivalry in political circles is very common and it would be wrong to say only one political party indulges in black magic and sorcery. This is noholds barred…,” he said”.

Was black magiv involved inn the death of Amma-2

The position and condition when Jaya was not feeling well (September to December 2016): What we can understand from this, are the following points[6]:

  1. Not willing to identify himself for security reasons, the spiritual guru said Jayalalithaa has suffered from bad health because she has too many rivals.
  2. “It’s not just people from the rival party (DMK) who have spent huge money on tantriks to damage Jayalalithaa’s health.
  3. “I have no hesitation in saying that she has detractors even within her own party (AIADMK) who wanted to see her suffer,” he said.
  4. News on the health condition of Jayalalithaa was being kept a top secret.

Thus, the nexus between the Dravidian politicians and the tantriks came out publically in the media. Ironically, none of the Dravidian ideologists like K. Veeramani, Kali Pungundran, “Viduthalai” Rajendran, Kolattur Mani and others refuted this, but, kept quite. Whom they were meeting, how the money paid, where the rituals taking place – the details – nothing known or revealed to anybody. Under such circumstances, the black magic affairs of one Karthikeyan came just after the death of Jayalalitha on 05-12-2016.

© Vedaprakash

28-03-2017

[1] In 1956 August first, Dravidia Kazhagam asked the volunteers to bum pictures of Lord Rama as the organization considered Ramayana as anti-women and anti lower castes etc. one Dravidia Kazhagam leader in the name of Thiruvarur Thangarajan wrote a new version of Ramayana way Rama was portrayed as a villain. The Dravidia Kazhagam film star M.R. Radha staged the play throughout the state. The Government led by the Chief Minister Kamaraj immediately banned the play but Dravidia Kazhagam after obtaining court’s pem1ission staged the play in selected towns.

[2]  At the instigation of Thiru E. V. Ramaswami Naicker, the Leader of Dravida Kazhagam, several tableaus depicting the picture of Gods Rama and Muruga were being beaten by a chappal in a procession held at Salem on 23rd and 24th January 1971. When one individual printed the photos of the procession, the DMK government banned and seized the posters.  The Government of Tamil Nadu issued a Notification G. O. Ms. No. 491 Home dated 12-2-1971 directing the posters to be forfeited to the Government on the ground that the said posters contained matters which promote or intend to promote the feelings of enmity and hatred between different classes of citizens of India or which is deliberately or maliciously intended to outrage the religious feelings of any such class by insulting the religion or the religious feelings of that class.

Madras High Court – Chinna Annamalai vs The State Of Tamil Nadu on 24 February, 1971; Equivalent citations: AIR 1971 Mad 448, 1971 CriLJ 1569, (1971) IIMLJ 158; Author: K Reddy; Bench: K Reddy, Ganesan, Maharajan.https://indiankanoon.org/doc/1710030/

[3] Frontline, Going backward, R. Krishnakumar in Thiruvananthapuram and In Dravidian land, R. Ilangovan in Chennai in Frontline, Print edition : October 4, 2013.

[4] http://www.frontline.in/cover-story/thriving-business/article5137608.ece

[5] Daily Mail, ‘Her enemies are making her suffer’: Top Astro Guru says CM Jayalalithaa is a victim of BLACK MAGIC, By MAIL TODAY BUREAU, PUBLISHED: 23:52 BST, 26 October 2016 | UPDATED: 00:16 BST, 27 October 2016

[6] http://www.dailymail.co.uk/indiahome/indianews/article-3875860/Her-enemies-making-suffer-Astro-Guru-says-CM-Jayalalithaa-victim-BLACK-MAGIC.html

The politics of burning effigies in 2016 by the Congress cons, Dravidian dons and JNU junkies!

October 14, 2016

The politics of burning effigies in 2016 by the Congress cons, Dravidian dons and JNU junkies!

ravana-lila-english-bannerDravidar Kazhagam’s racial approach continues even in 2016:  The misguided Dravidar Kazhagam, of various banners still, believes in Aryan-Dravidian racial hypotheses and theories” and work emotionally with raid radicalism. The day after Dussera was celebrated with the burning of effigies of King Raavan in many parts of the country on 12-10-2016, as announced, about 40 members of the Thanthai Periyar Dravidar Kazhagam [TPDK] landed at the Sanskrit College at Mylapore in Chennai on 13-10-2016 Wednesday to burn effigies of Ram, Sita and Lakshmanan[1].  The group had originally planned to hold the event outside the Madras Sanskrit College of Chennai to protest against the institution’s version of the Ramayana, but it was later shifted to a spot about a kilometre away due to police intervention[2]. While 11 of them were remanded under Section 285 of Indian Penal Code, 12 members of a Hindu group were detained near Sanskrit college in Mylapore[3]. Thus, the media differed in reporting the event.

ravana-lila-tamil-bannerPDK’s attempt to hold Ravan Leela flops[4]: Deccan Chronicle reported wth this caption. The attempt by Periyar Dravidar Kazhagam members to celebrate the Ravan leela deifying the demon king and projecting him as Dravidian stalwart, while belittling Lord Ram, turned into a fiasco with the police taking 55 persons of PDK into custody on Wednesday. Even before the members could assemble and burn an effigy in front of Sanskrit College, Mylapore, in the city on Wednesday evening, the police pre-empted their move and arrested 55 persons. The PDK had announced to stage Ravan leela as the outfit believed that Ravan was a Dravidian and burning his image during Dusshera celebrations in many parts of India amounted to “mocking” the Dravidians. “This is only a bid to stoke controversy and is intended to insult the Hindu gods and hurt the sentiments of the believers,” Hindu Makkal Katchi state president Arjun Sampath said reacting to the development. The staunch Hindu outfit has demanded the police to detain the PDK members under NSA and prevent such incidents in future. “The PDK is taking things a bit too far. The attempt to hold Ravan leela is an assault on our culture and it is highly condemnable,” Mr Sampath said[5].

lord-sri-rama-1971-dk-chappal-garlandedWhy Ravan leela? – the racist question asked by modernists!: The pro-Muslim media “Scroll.in” reported differently. This was the Periyarist group’s answer to Ram Leela – Ravanan Leela to demonstrate their opposition to the Ram Leela celebrations that depict the victory of King Ram over Raavan, who, according to Indian mythology, had kidnapped Ram’s wife Sita[6]. Amidst tight security, and all efforts of the police to stall the event, the members of the fringe group did manage to burn a few effigies, including that of Lord Ram[7]. Kumaran / Tinker Kumaron, a member of the TDPK said, “Every year, in North India, Ram Leela is celebrated by burning effigies of Raavan, This is being done to insult South Indians. We consider Raavan to be a Dravidian….As per our plan we broke the police chain around us and burned the effigy. 11 persons who were involved in burning effigies have been remanded by police.”

%e0%ae%a4%e0%af%8b%e0%ae%b4%e0%ae%b0%e0%af%8d-%e0%ae%a4%e0%ae%bf%e0%ae%b0%e0%af%81%e0%ae%95%e0%af%8d%e0%ae%95%e0%af%81%e0%ae%ae%e0%ae%b0%e0%ae%a9%e0%af%8d-%e0%ae%9a%e0%af%86%e0%ae%a9%e0%af%8dWhy is the President participating in Ram leela programme?: Speaking to The Hindu[8], G. Ramakrishnan, general secretary, Thanthai Periyar Dravidar Kazhagam, said that the act was a reaction to the celebration of Ram Leela as a part of Dusshera celebrations across North India, a festival in which the effigy of mythological character Ravanan is set on fire symbolically to represent victory of Lord Ram over Ravanan. “To us, Ramayana, though a mythological story, was a Aryan-Dravidian conflict where Lord Ram was shown to have won against Ravanan, who we consider as a Dravidian. The epic represents Ram as a God and Ravanan as a monster. This is the basis of our opposition,” he said. Criticising the recent celebrations at the Red Fort lawns, which was attended by several high-profile dignitaries including President Pranab Mukherjee, and Congress president Sonia Gandhi, Ramakrishnan wondered if India really was a secular country. “Why is the President participating in such a programme? He is the president to whole of India,” he said. It is evident that these people are behaving in this way, knowing the truth that the whole country has been celebrating for many years. Even hundreds years back, it was celebrated in Asfganistan, Pakistan, Bangladesh and other countries.

%e0%ae%a4%e0%ae%aa%e0%af%86%e0%ae%a4%e0%ae%bf%e0%ae%95-4Belief in race, racism and racialism: Condemning Ramayana’s ‘racist portrayal’ of ‘Dravidians as demons’, the TPDK said that the Ravanan Leela was their way of protesting against Hindu cultural hegemony. “It does not matter that ‘Ram Leela’ is not celebrated in Tamil Nadu. In Delhi, effigies of Ravanan and his two brothers are burnt, we believe that they are Dravidians and burning their effigies is mocking us. So to stop that, we have decided to celebrate ‘Ravana Leela’ in which we will be burning the effigies of Ram, Sita and Lakshman,” S Kumaran, another TDPL leader had told TNM earlier. He also added that they had written a letter to Prime Minister asking him to stop Ram Leela in Delhi but they did not get any response from his office.  “It is clearly proven once again that the rulers of India will never care to respect the feelings of the Southerners,” said the group. “If they have cared so, then they would not have ventured to burn the effigies of the three choicest heroes of the Dravidian race in the guise of honouring a hero of religious epic.” Kumaron said that this protest against Ram Leela celebrations gathered momentum in 1974, when the group sent a letter to Prime Minister Indira Gandhi demanding a stop to the festivities. But at that time too, they received no reply. Over the next few decades, there have been at least three instances when the group has burnt effigies of Ram, and and been arrested for this.

%e0%ae%aa%e0%af%8b%e0%ae%b2%e0%af%80%e0%ae%9a%e0%ae%bf%e0%ae%b8%e0%af%8d-%e0%ae%aa%e0%af%82%e0%ae%9f%e0%af%8d%e0%ae%b8%e0%af%8d-%e0%ae%95%e0%ae%be%e0%ae%b2%e0%ae%bf%e0%ae%b2%e0%af%8d-%e0%ae%aeSplinter groups playing dangerous games: Veeramani and “Viduthalai” Rajendran had a break and Rajendran started “The Thanthai Periyar Dravidar Kazhagam” in 2012, claiming that they would follow the teachings of social activist and politician EV Ramaswami Naicker or Periyar, who had also questioned the portrayal of Raavan in the popular version of the Ramayana. As reported in Outlook, some of the questions posed by Periyar were, “Isn’t it true that Ravaan abducted Sita as an honourable revenge for the insult heaped upon his sister? Isn’t it a Brahminical ploy to give the colour of lust to a most honourable kidnapping?” The DK spinter groups have always been attacking the soft target – the Brahmins! They cruelly cut a poor Brahmin at West Mambalam some years ago with aruval (study sword), and another Brahmin in Mylapore last year (April 2015)[9].

%e0%ae%a4%e0%ae%ae%e0%ae%bf%e0%ae%b4%e0%ae%95%e0%ae%a4%e0%af%8d%e0%ae%a4%e0%ae%bf%e0%ae%a9%e0%af%8d-%e0%ae%aa%e0%ae%be%e0%ae%b0%e0%af%8d%e0%ae%aa%e0%af%8d%e0%ae%aa%e0%ae%a9%e0%ae%bf%e0%ae%af-%e0%ae%8eSplinter DK groups attack Brahmins following the path of Periyar: MT Saju writes that in the 1970s too, Periyarists conducted Ravanan Leelas. He reminds us that after Periyar died, his wife Maniyammai burnt the effigy of Ram at Periyar Thidal in 1974[10]. But since then, it has not been a popular event. Thus, for some reason, some people want to create ruckus now. Dravidian movement analyst K Thirunavukarrasu said that this anti-Ram sentiment has existed since the beginning of the Dravidian movement in the 1920s. The 1940s saw the publication of works such as Raavana Kaviyam (Raavana Epic) by Pulavar Kuzhandhai and Iranyan Allathu Inayatra Veeran(Hiranya or the Unparalleled Warrior) by Bharatidasan, which eulogised the characters Raavan and Hiranyakashyap, who had been depicted as asuras in popular versions of Indian mythological stories. “The asuras have been depicted in these stories in a manner that denigrates Dravidians,” said Thirunavukarrasu. As Periyar used to say, “If you see a snake and Brahmin, leave snake but kill Brahmin”, these goons are following such bloody method.

jnu-modi-effigy_2016Dravidian King Ravana was a Brahmin: The atheist Dravidian ideologists do not believe Puranas, yet, they believe them for their myth-making. As they believe Aryan-Dravidian race theories, at one side they claim that Ravana was a Brahmin! “The intention of the Dravidian movement is to oppose the depiction of Dravidas as asuras in all these plays.” Tamil writer D Ravikumar said that according to the version of the Ramayana written by medieval Tamil poet Kambar, Raavan was not a Dravidian King but a Brahmin. “If you look at this from the lens of Kambar’s Ramayana, it is hard to say how he came to be associated with Dravidian identity,” said Ravikumar. Ravikumar said that around the 1960s, Tamil Nadu politics was based on antagonism towards North India, Brahminism, Aryans and Hindi. The protest against Ram Leelas rode on this sentiment, he said. But in the 1970s and 1980s, the issue became irrelevant. When the main parties in power were all Dravidian parties, it was no longer a vote-catching subject. “Now, this has been revived by some groups after the BJP has come to power,” said Ravikumar. “Raavan acts as an anti-BJP symbol. But we don’t know how successful it will be.”

%e0%ae%b0%e0%ae%be%e0%ae%ae%e0%ae%9a%e0%af%87%e0%ae%a4%e0%af%81-%e0%ae%95%e0%ae%b0%e0%af%81Karunanidhi playing Ravana (1998): On October 1, 1998, Anoor Jagadeesan, president of PDK and 16 others were arrested when they tried to burn the effigies of Rama and Lakshmana in Chennai[11]. On October 18, 1998, Karunanidhi asserted that[12], “….if you insult Ravana, you are insulting me”. In Ramasethu issue also, he passed remarks asking “In which engineering college Rama studied” (so that he could build a bridge). Even, Kamal Hasan also used to utter that he came from Ravan geneology or something like that!

r-s-manohar-as-ravanaIlangeswaran vs Ravana Leela: R. S. Manohar (1925-2006) used to portray all Asuras as heroes – Surapadman, Sisupalan, Narakasuran, Indrajit, Sukrachariyar etc., in his characteristic projection in his dramas, which were successful in 1970-80s. He too projected Ravana as “Ilankeswaran”, the Lord of Lanka, but, not the Dravidian way of contempt, hatred and blasphemy. In fact, he followed the Puranic narration and other hagiographical details. Understandably, he was never supported or honoured by the Dravidian leaders or even Periyar for his donning Asuras! And now, the fringe elements have started the old game, when the Dravidian CM, that too, a lady has been ailing in hospital.

the-ravan-effigy-burned-at-jnuModi effigy burned by the Congress and JNU students[13]: A group of students of Jawaharlal Nehru University (JNU) on 11-10-2016 Tuesday burnt the effigy of Prime Minister Narendra Modi, BJP chief chief Amit Shah, Mahatma Gandhi’s killer Nathuram Godse and others to mark the “victory of truth over falsehood” on the occasion of Dussehra. Members of the Congress-backed National Students’ Union of India (NSUI) on Tuesday night celebrated Dussehra by burning the effigy of Modi and others to protest against the growing interference of the Centre in universities and attacks on Dalits.“We celebrated the victory of truth over falsehood in a modern and democratic country by burning effigies. For us Modi and RSS are symbol of untruth,” said Sunny Diman, an NSUI member[14]. So, the Congress party too has taken such method of politics of burning effigies exploiting the occasion of “Viyayadasami”. Ironically, the Congress leaders have been questioning the successful surgical operations on these days at one side and indulging in such cheap and vulgar activities at another side.

© Vedaprakash

14-10-2016

the-ravan-effigy-burned-at-jnu-with-students

[1] The News Minute, Dravidian Ravanan Leela: Periyarists burn Ram effigy even as police try to stop them, by TNM Staff, Thursday, October 13, 2016 – 11:31.

[2] Scroll.in, Why a Dravidian fringe group burnt effigies of Ram and Sita in Chennai this year, by Vinita Govindarajan. October 13, 2016, 8 pm.

[3] The Hindu, TPDK Cadres arrested in chennai for burning effigy of Lord Ram, Chennai 13, 2016, Updated: October 13, 2016 07:23 IST

[4] Deccan Chronicle, PDK’s attempt to hold Ravan Leela flops, Published Oct 13, 2016, 7:00 am IST, Updated Oct 13, 2016, 7:01 am IST

[5] http://www.deccanchronicle.com/nation/in-other-news/131016/pdks-attempt-to-hold-ravan-leela-flops.html

[6] http://scroll.in/article/818922/why-a-dravidian-fringe-group-burnt-effigies-of-ram-and-sita-in-chennai-this-year

[7] http://www.thenewsminute.com/article/dravidian-ravanan-leela-periyarists-burn-ram-effigy-even-police-try-stop-them-51281

[8] http://www.thehindu.com/news/cities/chennai/tpdk-cadres-arrested-in-chennai-for-burning-effigy-of-lord-ram/article9213004.ece

[9] http://www.thehindu.com/news/cities/chennai/six-dvk-men-held-for-attacks-on-priests-in-chennai/article7127953.ece

[10] http://epaperbeta.timesofindia.com/Article.aspx?eid=31807&articlexml=TWIST-TO-THE-TALE-Reviving-Ravanlila-to-counter-13102016006020

[11] Ajith Pillai and A. S. Paneerselvan, Good Or Evil? The  Politics Of  Ravana, Outlook, Novemver.2, 1998.

[12] http://www.outlookindia.com/magazine/story/good-or-evil-the-politics-of-ravana/206444

[13] The Hindustan Times, Delhi: Students burn effigy of Modi, Shah, Godse at JNU campus on Dussehra, HT Correspondent, Hindustan Times, New Delhi, Updated: Oct 13, 2016 10:08 IST

[14] http://www.hindustantimes.com/delhi/students-burn-effigy-of-modi-shah-at-jnu-campus-dubbing-them-as-ravana/story-twLk2C05xBVCRaVR5ScVvO.html

Hindu Maya and Christian Cyber-missions, evangelism and Implications

November 5, 2012

Hindu Maya and Christian Cyber-missions, evangelism and Implications

Iwrote this five years back anticipitating the Chritian propaganda unleashed through cyber-space with the blessings of MNCs. With the LPG, they target Indian society easily with their aggressive marketing capabilities using all methods without any code of ethics or morality. Considering the relevancy and context, I post this here without any change salvaging from Internet.

 Cyber-mission on war-path to attack India – the First Crusade may start at any time: On 30th July, 2007, John Dyal was interviewed by the NDTV news reader and repeatedly asked about the Catholic Cyber Conversion adopted and adapted recently. Reacting to this, vigorously and crazily John Dyal started justifying it. When persisted how religion could be brought to the virtual world, he blurted out that “Why not” – Hindus say that the entire world is Maya. Then, it was shown as if the TV crew get opinion of Delhi-students with Christian, half-Christian-half-Hindu and Hindu names accepting and supporting such Cyber-conversion, evidently without understanding the implications. Thus, it appears that Vatican has incorporated Cyber-mission in its agenda and there would be more Roberto de Nobilis, Beschis, Bede Griffiths, Hans Staffners, Clooneys, and so on with laptops with wireless internet connections. Of course, they started already.

 Definition of Cyber-crusade / Holy-War / Jihad: John Edmiston discussed about, “Missions in Cyberspace: The Strategic Front-Line Use Of The Internet In Missions“, in www.cybermissions.org. He claims: “One of these means is the use of theInternet. And one of the most exhilarating frontiers of mission today is cyber-missions; the frontline use of IT to evangelize and disciple the nations. In this article we will keep the focus on cross-cultural mission web sites and strategic approaches to ministry online such as web-evangelism, email discipleship, web-based TEE and icafes as a church-planting strategy. This paper will review the potential, the actual uses and the successful implementation of Internet-based missionary outreach and put the case for missionary societies to have an Internet evangelism department headed by a Field Director – Cyberspace. I have intentionally excluded the traditional uses of computing in missions or the use of the Internet for mono-cultural ministry as this has already been extensively reviewed elsewhere (for instance in the work of Leonard Sweet)” [the key words are given in colour].

 Hindus untochables or experts in Cyber-religion? Can Hindus match for this? Are they prepared to take? Yes, definitely, Hindus are capable considering the IT workers and experts in the field. But, the Christians think differently, if all these Hindu guys and girls are converted, what would happen to Hindu religion? Yes, with single stroke, they can strategically enslave the Cyber-untochables and John Daya & Co., would start fighting for them also starting a Cyber-Dalit Liberation Front, All India Cyber-SC-ST Federation for which D’Souza, Udit Raj and others  might be President, Secretary and so on sending reports to Bush, Bill Gates, Vatican, UN and what not.

 They give figures like this: Online Language Populations (September 2002): 

English 36.5%;Chinese 10.9%,

Japanese 9.7%,

Spanish 7.2%,

German 6.7%,

Korean 4.5%,
Italian 3.8%,
French 3.5%,Portuguese 3.0%,

Russian 2.9%,

Dutch 2.0% (Source: Global Reach)

We should have corresponding figures for users in Hindi, Tamil and other languages.The English includes, Hindu users also.

 

Warning – the anti-Hindu groups would gang together: Of course, they tie-up with Muslims, secularists, atheists, anti-Hindu groups etc., or they themselves create such web-missions with such names and attack Hindus by all means. Then, they would have MOU with non-Catholic evangelists of US and EURO countries with the respective Presidents agreeing with the Pope, the Head of Vatican City-State. As the anti-Hindu groups irrespective of their ideologies, gang together on stages in every meeting, seminar or conference, so also they join to attack.

 

The treatment of Hindu-men under Christian cyber-masters / employers: As the employers are Christians, they have already started pressure on Hindu IT workers and experts. Slowly, it would turn in different direction. When one young Indian software engineer went to US and working there, his fellow Americans used to ask him about the “sandal paste mark” on his forehead etc. Though, he used to give general explanation for their understanding, they used to argue with religious vigor. After some days, one of Americans gave him a Bible, asked to him to read and come for discussion. This is very similar to what has been happening in gulf-countries, where the sheik-masters used to try with Hindu-professionals.

 The treatment of Hindu-girs and women under Christian cyber-masters / employers: With Hindu girls and women, they behave differently. Starting with commenting on their mode of dress, colour etc., slowly, they praise about their beauty and so on. Of course, the Supreme Court judgment and direction about the treatment of women at work places applicable in India would not be applicable there and we do not know as to whether any equivalent Act, Rules or provisions are to check such “women teasing” [I do not want to use eve teasing, as they might take it as a right. Yes, as Jehovah teased Eve, the fundamentalist, fanatic Christians could think that it is their right to tease women following their Commandment of God].

 Infiltration into, manipulation of and hacking Internet groups: Some Hindu experts and professionals have been successful enough to bring out facts about Indian history, culture, tradition, heritage and civilization in internet. Reading such websites, many educated and learned students, scholars and even professors have been convinced about the logic and facts presented. After all, none could say other than what one generally accept to say “2 + 2 = 4”. Of course, mathematician experts, number theorists and analysts may disagree, that is healthy, intellectual and highly useful for humanity.

 Be careful about Carcinogenic Cyber Christians: Assessing the success or rather the impact, the Cyber-missions may all out to attack. So they start infiltrated with their cyber-expertise. As virus has been there affecting humanity, it has been there here also and we see the results. So we have to be careful about Carcinogenic Cyber Christians, who may be otherwise known as respectfully hackers and so on. The conversion of Indian civilization to Hindu civilization might be the reason for such cyber-invasion and infiltration.

 Hindus should not be just satisfied with Virtual pujas, Bajans, philosophy etc: Now, many Hindus are interested in Computers, Internet etc., because, they get wonderful-colourful pictures of Gods and Goddesses, Bajan-downloads, virtual pujas with all paraphernalia and so on.

 Of course, there are inter-religious skirmishes, philosophical debates with arrogance as usual, “I am modest treading middle-path or secular” type discussions. Here, over-zealous, pride and arrogant postings should be avoided, as the opponents may use such arguments against Hindus.

 Instead, they can discuss and debate about the rites, rituals and ceremonies conducted by them in different countries, how they differ, why divergence, why such differences are not made to India-criticizing scholars, etc., would be worthwhile.

 Hindus may get many e-mails regularly bombarding them to accept Christ for redemption. Of course from the desperate fundamentalist-fanatic categories, they may get threatening mails like “If you do not accept, you will go to hell” and so on. Of course, Hindus may get pornography also along with Jesus Christ or the Word of God with Satanic temptation! [I am not writing this with any wrong impression on Christians, with the past experience with Christians. My friends and I received hundreds of such letters, pamphlets and books from Christians, when Christian issues were discussed in Indian Express and other journals]. As time and space change, the tactics change but old-habits may not change.

 They may post some issues and divert or lead them to ticklish issues resulting in controversies. They may rehash the same old “Aryan-Dravidian”, anti-Brahmin like stuff. They may make personal attacks as a last resort. Or worst, they would accuse Hindus as “Hindutva-wadis”, “Saffron brigade”, “Hindu fundamentalists”, “Sanga parivar” and so on. Anyway, truth triumphs always.

 That is why I use to say often, we have to identify the Hindu-baiters, Hindu-enemies and Hindu-betrayers, expose them to all and treat them as such, as Hindu society cannot and could not produce or have such elements.

 Oh Hindus be ready.

kkVedaprakash <vedamvedaprakash@…>
To: hinducivilization@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2007 8:22:30 PM
Subject: [hc] Hindu Maya and Christian Cyber-missions, evangelism and Implications.

The so-called 300 / 3000 Ramayanas: The Dravidian propaganda

March 6, 2012

The so-called 300 / 3000 Ramayanas: The Dravidian propaganda

 By Sri Vedaprakash, March 16, 2008
 
Note: This topic is again and again brought to the notice of the readers. However, the atheists, the Dravidian propagandists, Communists, Christians and Muslims hiding under such banners again and again rake up the issue without reading Ramayana. Unfortunately, they even do not read what these Ramanujan, Paukla and others have written. Yet, they go on rehash the stuff. Therefore, I have to point out their hollowness to plant such mischievous postings appearing then and there.
Ramayana once again[1]!:Ever since the Sethu-Samuthram controversy has cropped up, the Dravidian ideologists, Karu’s Court Historians[2] and others ganged up together circulating the old-stories as authentic histories. Of course, the propaganda carried on by this hysterical gang has parallel only in Hitler’s camp. Of course, any reader can note it is the Black Parivar[3] and the Red Parivar[4] would very often take the Hitler-stick to beat others, but they do not realize that they have been following only Hitler. Coming to the point, now their main attack has been against Rama and Ramayana and therefore, the Karu’s Court historians started digging up old polemical writings, scurrilous pamphlets and anti-Hindu literature to serve their perverted purpose.

The “Viduthalai” [5] (March 14th and 13th dated), the DK-mouth piece, but with the blessings of Karu has brought out one brief of A. K. Ramanujam’s paper “Three Hundred Ramayanas”. T. R. Balu has made a visit and met Karu on 14th. Therefore, the coincidence can be noted and there would be raking up the issue again. The Communist super intelligent leaders have also started the nonsensical blabbering that Ramayana is myth and so on.

The Dravidian Love for Paula Richman: Recently, the Dravidian protagonists have again started their blasphemy against Sri Rama under the guise of historical research, analytical wisdom, Aryan-Dravidian race hypotheses[6] , their (Aryan-Dravidian) continuous struggle-for- ever in India and other ideologies. Incidentally, now, one way or the other, as they have drawn attention to Paula Richman’s book, “Many Ramayanas”, it is imperative to read what exactly, she mentions about the subject, which has been so fascinated to these atheist rabble-rousers. I have read the book carefully and particularly, the interpretations, many times to understand the psyche behind it. Actually, the whole story has not been new Indian scholars, researchers and at least, those who know about the origin of Ramayana[7]. A. K. Ramanujam’s paper[8] “Three Hundred Ramayanas” appears in “Many Ramayanas” of Paula Richman.

The book is nothing but compilation of articles of different personalities, purportly to look into the diversity of a narrative tradition in South Asia. Narrative, rendering, oral tradition, from oral to writing and vice versa, translation etc., can be entertained only literary criticism, when such liberality of literature is there in a society. Where, the thought process is control, such exercise cannot be undertaken. In fact, in many non-Indian societies, such narrative, rendering, oral tradition, from oral to writing and vice versa, translation etc., had been done away long back. Even today in the so-called modern, civilized, advanced, progressed, etc., times, such exercise is not possible in other non-Indian literature. Therefore, the literary critics should understand and appreciate the nuances, before criticizing the “many Ramayanas” or sending wrong signals.

Paula Richman has stories of A. K. Ramanujan, Frank E. Reynolds, Kathleen E. Erndl, David Shulman, Velcheru Narayan Rao, Clinton Seely, Staurt H. Blackburn, Paula Richman, Patricia Y. Mumme, Philip Lutgendorf, and Ramdas Lamb discuss about such narratives etc., and it appears as English rendering of any Tamil Pattimandram discussing the very old questions of mutilation of Surpanaka, Sita’s fire ordeal, etc. Unfortuinately, the sole aim of the compilation appears to deride, disparage and denigrate by choosing the topic under the guise research with historical camouflage.

300 or 3000 Ramayanas?: That there are “300 Ramayanas” as exactly counted has not been the original idea of A. K. Ramanujan, but, as he himself confessed that it belongs to one “student of Ramayana”, Canille Bulcke[9], who only counted so – exactly 300! Then to add his contribution, A. K. Ramanujan mentions[10] that according to a Kannada scholar[11] there are more than a thousand Ramayanas in Kannada! Then, adds that according to a Telugu scholar[12] there are more than a thousand Ramayanas in Telugu! At least, the Telugu scholar appears to be probably reasonable, as he said “more than a thousand”! It is not known why the learned scholar stops with, as he could have consulted Malayali scholar, Marathi scholar, Oriya scholar, Bengali scholar, Gujarathi scholar, Rajasthani scholar, Hindi scholar, Kashmiri scholar and so on.

So here, the point is that Ramayana story has been so popular among every society of the ancient civilizations and accepted by the members of different societies, each member wanted to recognize and transform such Ramayana character to the identified members of society or vice versa for exhibiting similar or same characteristics. When one asks, “Ey, why are you sleeping like Kumbakarna?” , it does not imply that his brother is like Ravana and so on. It has been used figuratively to drive out the point as such characterization has been known to everybody. Thus, he cannot be considered to have created one more Ramayana!

The so-called freedom of thought expression and opinion: The existence of 300 or 3,000 or 30,000 Ramayanas has been the credit to the popularity of Ramayana as a human-literature, Universal literature long back and it does not discredit as the existence of more Bibles[13] or Quarans or Korans[14], as the very mention would be anathema. Perhaps, the persons, who talk about “300 Ramayanas” do not know the existence of more Bibles or Korans., but the faithful believers destroyed many or all according to their own estimate and accounting and finally have one “printed version”, declared as infallible and revealed through God as the “Word of God”, so none could change anything thereafter. But they do not explain why there were hundreds of Bibles and Korans and why they were destroyed. How they could have selected the existing version only as the exact tract as revealed to their respective prophets to be accepted as authentic and authorized. How such divine grace had descended on the chosen group to decide and do accordingly.

Indians have not leaned the art of editing, expurging and interpolation of verses of books, as done by the non-Indians. They have not learned the art of destruction of earlier, differing or opposing versions and to claim that this is the only “Authorized version” or “Revealed Book”.

The Arabic tradition of rendering Poetry and Koran: The Arabic tradition has been that the Arabic poets would only recite their poems, be listened and enjoyed and appreciated by others and they were never written down. Particularly, in the case of Koran, it was strongly believed that as it was revealed by Allah through Jibreal / Gabriel to the Prophet Mohammed (PBCH), it has to be learned by heart by listening to the recital by the experts. There had / have been groups exclusively for the purpose of recital of Koran. Only later, the writing down of Koran and its translation into other non-Arabic languages started. As Ibn Warraq has elaborately dealt with about it, it is not discussed here. In fact, Mohammed Mamaduke Picthall[15] in his foreword clearly records the following points:

1.. It may be reasonably claimed that no Holy Scriptures can be fairly presented by one who disbelieves its inspiration and its message.
2.. The Koran cannot be translated. That is the belief of old-fashioned sheikhs and the view of the present writer (H. M. Pitchall).
3.. …the Glorious Koran, that inimitable symphony, the very sounds of which move men to tears and ecstasy.

In India, the society has been liberal, democratic and egalitarian, so the members have liberty to pursue their literary pursuits. Thus, they make one God to many Gods; make male and female Gods with child God also; many times lover; employer and slave; chieftain, king and emperor and so on. It increases his thinking and creativity. The painter and sculptors too follow such pattern and depict Gods and Goddesses accordingly. This is the real freedom of thought, expression, and exhibition of artistic talent. That is why the negative characterization is opposed and condemned. Nowadays, it has become fashion for elite artists, eminent historians and social activists to come out and support such errant perverts, but it is not correct, as could be seen. For example, A cannot of sleeping with B’s wife, just because, he has the freedom of thinking. Having such freedom of thinking, he cannot express openly to B, because he has freedom of expression. As B too have such rights and starts exercise his rights of freedom of thought and expression the consequences are well known. Therefore, there are individual rights which should not violate the rights of others. If this fundamental is not known or knowingly, continuously violated, definitely the peaceful people may react one day. Therefore, it is better to live amicably instead of provoking others. In such situations and conditions, only the provoking forces are barbaric, medieval, lumpen and so on.

Any other world literature does not have such elasticity, flexibility, liberality, democracy, egalitarianism proves that they are controlled and suppressed. Therefore, there cannot be any freedom of thought, expression and opinion entertained in such societies. Even, there is no freedom to tell the fact that there were 300 / 3000 Bibles and Korans, but they were destroyed and now there is only one! Here, Salman Rusdie and H. F. Hussain can be contrasted in the context; Ibn Warraq and EVR; Karunanidhi and Taslima Nasreen; Bertrand Russell and Thomas Paine; and so on.

Ramayana characters could be human beings of any age: As mentioned, because of the flexibility of the characterization of Ramayana, it is applicable to any time and place. Ramayana and Mahabharata are played everywhere by the people with their available men and materials. Therefore, in such depiction, dramatization and adapted-rendering, there would variance in all aspects. Taking these literary critics cannot make big fuss out of it. Now Rama and Ravana may come with pants and shirts also. If it becomes, popular, it would be carried on enjoyed by a group. Can it we say, it is 301th Ramayana or 3001th? Yes, it is correct, “as long as there are many Ramas, there would be more Ramayanas”.

But no other literature could be subjected to such process, as in the non-Indian tradition, the very such thought might be unthinkable. We cannot have many non-Indian heroes or Gods. Can Paula Richman produce an edition of “Many Bibles”, “Many Qurans”, like that or any narratives and oral traditions of Jesus, Mary, Joseph, Mohammed, Fatima etc.(just for example, it is asked). Believers of the respective lands and countries know the existence of such narratives, renderings and oral traditions available here and there, but Paula cannot compile. Why even the New Testament apocrypha or Hadis renderings are not discussed, debated and papers presented.

Who can analyze the non-Indian characters (including heroes and heroines, deified heroes and heroines and Gods and Goddesses themselves), criticize or justify their acts of omission or commission, and bring all renderings along with Thomas Paine, Robert Ingersol, Salmon Rushdie, Taslima Nasreen etc. Even Tembavani[16] and Sirappuranam[ 17] cannot be rendered in English, as the orthodox might oppose some verses. In fact, they had already objected to “Kesadhipada varnanai” (= the Tamil traditional narrative of a woman character whoever may be from head to feet, part by part) and removed such verses. Therefore, without going into the details, the western scholars go on commit blunders under the guise of research and it is totally wrong. They should ponder over. As they have big-big University labels, our Dravidian friends immediately, take their renderings and they produce their own renderings to blaspheme Hindus. Here only, the problem comes.

SUN-TV and Ramayana: In SUN-TV group of companies, Karunanidhi and his family members have shares. So why SUN-TV all of sudden start broadcasting “Ramayana”, that too, the much hated, criticized and blasphemed one. Why not the “Ravana Kaviyam” of Kulandai? It is promoted, looked. Loved and considered as “divine” by the Dravidian protagonists including Karnanidhi. He has already accepted that he supports Ravana and he belongs to such clan! Of course, even Kalainjar TV cannot be prevented in broadcasting Ramayana or Mahabhrata, but what about the ideology? They cannot abuse Hindus and cater them with this tamasha. They cannot kill Hindu culture and do this nonsense. They cannot soil the sanctity of temples and try to do some gimmicks. Of course, we know they do not follow the dictum of “Padippathu Ramayanam, idippathu Pillaiyar koil”, but, they meddle with Ramayana and demolish the Temple of Ramayana. That is why now the target is Ramar-palam!

References

[1] Today when I started typing this, SUN-TV of the Black Parivar has started broadcasting “Ramayana”! Even Kalainjar TV broadcast Ramayana!

[2] Vedaprakash, Why Tamilnadu Historians tell lies?, http://www.indiainteracts. com

[3] DK-DMK-PMK-Viduthal ai Puligar, their affiliated parties, associations and ideological subsidiaries.

[4] Al Communists parties CPI-CPI(M), CPI (ML) their affiliated parties, associations and ideological subsidiaries.

[5] It is only summarized one, of course with abusive language used characteristically in the Tamil translation.

[6] In spite of the fact that the Aryan-Dravidian hypotheses and Aryan Invasion Theory (AIT) have been proved unhistorical and baseless, these ideologists continue to believe and carry on the propaganda and rouse passion in the same language as they used to speak some 40 to 60 years back.

[7] In the Journals of Royal Asiatic society, All India Oriental Conference and others, enough has been discussed and debated about Valmiki Ramayana and the Jain and Buddhist version of their Ramayanas.

[8] A. K. Ramanujam, “Three Hundred Ramayanas”, Many Ramayanas, edited by Paula Richman, 1991, University of California Press, USA, pp.22-49.

[9] A. K. Ramanujam, opt.cit, p.24.

[10] Ibid, however, he does not mention the name of the Kannada scholar who could count exactly 1000!

[11] This “According to….” makes one remember, “The Gospel according to St. Matthew”, “The Gospel according to St. Mark”, “The Gospel according to St. Luke”, “The Gospel according to St. John”, and so on!

[12] Ibid, here also, he does not mention the name of the Telugu scholar who could count more than 1000!

[13] H. G. G. Herklots, How the Bible Came to us?, Penguin Books, UK, 1959.

[14] Ibn Warraq, Why I am not a Muslim, Promethecus Books, New York, 1995, p.20, 73-76.

[15] Mohammed Mamaduke Picthall, The Meaning of the holy Quran, Crescent Publishing Company , New Delhi,

[16] A Tamil literary work produced on the lines of or rather imitating Kamba Ramayanam.

[17] A Tamil literary work produced on the lines of or rather imitating Kamba Ramayanam, but some Mohammedans claim that it is even superior to Kamba Ramayana, of course, they do not talk about the editing, expunction and removal verses and other modifications done.

Historians as witnesses and Sunni Wakf Board Experts!

October 16, 2010

Ramajanmabhumi-Babarimasjid, evidences and Court or

Hisorians as witnesses and Sunni Wakf Board Experts!

Vedaprakash

Ramajanmabhumi-Babarimasjid and eminent hisorians: The eminent historians would appear immediately, whenever “Rama” appears in the headlines of Indian media. They start interpreting historicity of “Ramayana” according to their own way without any regard for the other view or perspective[1]. Even in the case of Sethu-samuthram, they started writing in “the Hindu” and EPW grinding their mills as usual[2]. Of course, the left media does / did not want the opinion of the others[3]. They vociferously lecture and write that they would appeal against the judgment and so on, but disappear thereafter. They exploit every forum like IHC etc., only to project their viewpoint[4]. Romila Thapar roared, “We would appeal against this jugment”, when the so-called “Hindutva judgment” came[5], but nothing happened! And the faithful readers of “The Hindu”, Frontline, EPW and the devoted members of IHC etc., also do not bother as to why their eminent historians tell lies or play such dubious games? Why they believe the eminent historians, because of their eminence or for their duplicity? Have they ever thought about them as to why they behave like that? Now, again these left / eminent intellectuals / historians have been busy with issuing statements. Besides, historians and experts others too join!

130 experts sign – ASI report should be made public, says appeal to Chief Justice[6] (14-10-2010): Now 130 experts have come out with an open letter addressed to the Chief Justice of India! The news reports say like this, “The Allahabad High Court based a significant part of its judgment in the Ayodhya case on the evidence provided by the Archaeological Survey of India’s report on its excavations at the site, submitted to the court in 2003. They accuse that the report is still hidden from the public eye, and a virtual gag order placed on archaeologists who acted as observers during the excavation[7]. Now that the judgment has been pronounced, a group of 130 academics, activists and intellectuals have demanded that the ASI report be published. In an open letter[8] to the Chief Justice of India and the Chief Justice of the Allahabad High Court, they urged that the report “be made available for scrutiny in the public domain, especially to scholars, as it is now a part of the public judicial record.” The ASI report, which concluded that a temple had existed at the site, has been criticised by many archaeologists for ignoring evidence such as animal bones, which would not have been found in a temple for Ram, and the existence of glazed pottery and graves at all levels which indicated Muslim residence”[9].

Shereen Ratnagar and D. Mandal were slapped with contempt of court charges by the Allahabad High Court: “In May, archaeologists Shereen Ratnagar and D. Mandal were slapped with contempt of court charges by the Allahabad High Court for sharing their observations in a book, titled “Ayodhya: Archaeology After Excavation”, published by Tulika in 2007. The orders in that case have been reserved”. That means they know the implications of the law. That is why they have been keeping quite since 2003!

The open letter and signatories: “The open letter notes that, “the world at large is equally constrained to silence. Such a judicially ordained zone of uncertainty curbs freedom of expression and fair comment.” Indians have never seen them in other caes where such issues have been involved. Thus, they want to selective!

Signatories: “The letter was signed by well-known Indian academics such as Sumit Sarkar, Uma Chakravarti, K.N. Pannikkar, K. Satchidanandan, Ajay Dandekar and filmmakers such as Anand Patwardhan, as well as less well-known Indian citizens – a software engineer, a textile design consultant, a teacher[10]. Academics from abroad – including those from universities in London, Chicago, Stockholm and Copenhagen – have also signed the letter, as friends of India”. This type of letters have been issued since 1992 and many times, the so-called signatories say that they have simply agreed to include their names in such letters. In some cases, they did / do not know also about the inclusion of their names!

Romila Thapar and others: Statement issued through Sahamat (01-10-2010): Another report goes like this: “Questioning the verdict of the Allahabad High Court on the Ram Janmabhoomi-Babri Masjid title suits, a group of left-leaning intellectuals on Friday said the judgment was “yet another blow to the secular fabric of the country” and the “repute of our judiciary”.  The scholars, including Romila Thapar, K M Shrimali, K N Pannikar, Irfan Habib, Utsa Patnaik and C P Chandrasekhar, said in a statement through the platform of Safdar Hashmi Memorial Trust (SAHMAT) that the verdict had raised “serious concerns” because of the way history, reason and secular values had been treated in it. “The view that the Babri Masjid was built at the site of a Hindu temple, which has been maintained by two of the three judges, takes no account of all the evidence contrary to this fact turned up by the Archaeological Survey of India’s own excavations — the presence of animal bones throughout as well as the use of ‘surkhi’ and lime mortar (all characteristic of Muslim presence) rule out the possibility of a Hindu temple having been there beneath the mosque,” the statement noted.

The verdict on Ayodhya: a historian’s perspective[11] (01-10-2010): Under this caption, the view of romila thapar appeared in “The Hindu”. It goes like this, “It has annulled respect for history and seeks to replace it with religious faith.

“The verdict is a political judgment and reflects a decision which could as well have been taken by the state years ago. Its focus is on the possession of land and the building a new temple to replace the destroyed mosque. The problem was entangled in contemporary politics involving religious identities but also claimed to be based on historical evidence. This latter aspect has been invoked but subsequently set aside in the judgment.

“The court has declared that a particular spot is where a divine or semi-divine person was born and where a new temple is to be built to commemorate the birth. This is in response to an appeal by Hindu faith and belief[12]. Given the absence of evidence in support of the claim, such a verdict is not what one expects from a court of law. Hindus deeply revere Rama as a deity but can this support a legal decision on claims to a birth-place, possession of land and the deliberate destruction of a major historical monument to assist in acquiring the land?

“The verdict claims that there was a temple of the 12th Century AD at the site which was destroyed to build the mosque — hence the legitimacy of building a new temple.

“The excavations of the Archaeological Survey of India (ASI) and its readings have been fully accepted even though these have been strongly disputed by other archaeologists and historians. Since this is a matter of professional expertise on which there was a sharp difference of opinion the categorical acceptance of the one point of view, and that too in a simplistic manner, does little to build confidence in the verdict. One judge stated that he did not delve into the historical aspect since he was not a historian but went to say that history and archaeology were not absolutely essential to decide these suits! Yet what are at issue are the historicity of the claims and the historical structures of the past one millennium.

“A mosque built almost 500 years ago and which was part of our cultural heritage[13] was destroyed wilfully by a mob urged on by a political leadership. There is no mention in the summary of the verdict that this act of wanton destruction, and a crime against our heritage, should be condemned. The new temple will have its sanctum — the presumed birthplace of Rama — in the area of the debris of the mosque. Whereas the destruction of the supposed temple is condemned and becomes the justification for building a new temple, the destruction of the mosque is not, perhaps by placing it conveniently outside the purview of the case.

“Has created a precedent[14]: The verdict has created a precedent in the court of law that land can be claimed by declaring it to be the birthplace of a divine or semi-divine being worshipped by a group that defines itself as a community. There will now be many such janmasthans wherever appropriate property can be found or a required dispute manufactured. Since the deliberate destruction of historical monuments has not been condemned what is to stop people from continuing to destroy others? The legislation of 1993 against changing the status of places of worship has been, as we have seen in recent years, quite ineffective.

What happened in history, happened. It cannot be changed[15]. But we can learn to understand what happened in its fuller context and strive to look at it on the basis of reliable evidence. We cannot change the pas[16]t to justify the politics of the present. The verdict has annulled respect for history and seeks to replace history with religious faith. True reconciliation can only come when there is confidence that the law in this country bases itself not just on faith and belief, but on evidence”.

Earlier stand – Irfan Habib (01-10-2010): “With the three judges pronouncing differing opinions on the historical and archaeological aspects of the case in the Allahabad High Court’s judgement on the disputed land in Ayodhya, many leading historians have been left bemused. “It’s not a logical judgement with so many parts going 2-1. One does not accept the logicality of the judgement,” said Irfan Habib, a noted historian and a former Chairman of the Indian Council of Historical Research who earlier taught at the Aligarh Muslim University. He noted that the verdict seemed to legitimise the events of 1949[17], when an idol was placed inside the mosque, by constant references. On the other hand, by minimising any mentions of the demolition of the Babri Masjid in 1992, the court seemed to be disregarding it, he said. He also expressed surprise that two judges questioned the date of construction of the Babri Masjid, as well as the involvement of emperor Babar or his commander Mir Baqi, since there had been clear inscriptions to this effect before the demolition. “Things that are totally clear historically, the court has tried to muddy,” he said[18].

D. N. Jha: “The historical evidence has not been taken into account,” said D.N. Jha, history professor at the Delhi University. Noting the judgement’s mention of the “faith and belief of Hindus” in reference to the history of the disputed structure, Dr. Jha asked why the court had requested an excavation of the site.“If it is a case of ‘belief,’ then it becomes an issue of theology, not archaeology. Should the judiciary be deciding cases on the basis of theology is a question that needs to be asked,” he said.

Supriya Verma, one of the observers: Professional archaeologists also noted that the judges did not seem to rely heavily on the Archaeological Survey of India’s court-directed excavation of the site in 2003, at least in the summaries of their verdict available on Thursday evening. “Somewhere, there is doubt about the credibility of that report,” said Supriya Verma of the Jawaharlal Nehru University, who acted as an observer during the ASI excavation. She noted that neither Justice Sudhir Agarwal nor Justice Dharam Veer Sharma even referenced the ASI report to support his conclusion on the existence of a temple on the site before the mosque was built. “It is almost as though they themselves were not convinced by the evidence. They are clearly conceding that there was no archaeological evidence of a temple or of its demolition…It is a judgement of theology,” she said.

Jaya Menon, one of the observers: Another observer of the ASI excavation, Jaya Menon of the Aligarh Muslim University, noted that the ASI report itself did not provide any evidence of a demolition, and only asserted the existence of a temple in its conclusion. “So I don’t know on what basis they made their judgements,” she said. The ASI report had been criticised by many archaeologists for ignoring evidence such as animal bones, which would not have been found in a temple for Ram, and the existence of glazed pottery and graves which indicated Muslim residents.

The eminent historians as witnesses of Muslims in the Allahabad case: The eminent historians, historical experts  and leftist manufacturers never bother about their secular credentials.  It is not known as to why these coteries should always support for the Masjid or Muslim cause. Ironically, the following have been the witnesses of the case in question, which is criticised by them:

Sl.No Witness no Name of the witness
1 Witness No. 63 R.S. Sharma
2 Witness No. 64 Suraj Bhan
3 Witness No. 65 D.N. Jha[19]
4 Witness No. 66 Romila Thapar
5 Witness No. 70 Irfan Habib
6 Witness No. 72 B.N. Pandey
7 Witness No. 95 K.M. Shrimali
8 Witness No. 99 Satish Chandra
9 Witness No. 102 Gyanendra Pandey

Then, where is their loci standi in criticising the judgment and Court? As witnesses, definitely, they could have deposed before the judges presenting their “historical facts” as they only know how to interpret! The public perhaps, even today do not know that in secular India, these historians stood witnesses to the Muslims! Why none has appeared for Hindus or temple cause? When the cold-blooded terrorist and heinous killer like Kasab is given legal aid, why none appeared for the non-Muslim and non-mosque group? Where is secularism? Would they come out in the public what they told to the judges in the Court? However, the poor show showed in the court by them raises many questions.

HC judge exposed experts espousing Masjids cause: Waqf Board Line-Up Accused Of Having Ostrich-Like Attitude:  The role played by independent experts, historians and archaeologists who appeared on behalf of the Waqf Board to support its claim has come in for criticism by one Allahabad High Court judge in the Ayodhya verdict. While the special bench of three judges unanimously dismissed objections raised by the experts to the presence of a temple, it was Justice Sudhir Agarwal who put their claims to extended judicial scrutiny. Most of these experts deposed twice. Before the ASI excavations, they said there was no temple beneath the mosque and, after the site had been dug up,they claimed what was unearthed was a mosque or a stupa. During lengthy cross-examination spread over several pages and recorded by Justice Agarwal, the historians and experts were subjected to pointed queries about their expertise, background and basis for their opinions.
To the courts astonishment, some who had written signed articles and issued pamphlets, were withering under scrutiny and the judge said they were displayed an ostrich-like attitude to facts. He also pointed out how the independent witnesses were connected one had done a PhD under the other, another had contributed an article to a book penned by a witness.

The vociverous historians could not give evidences properly as witnesses with all their extertise[20]: Some instances underlined by the judge are[21]:

  • Suvira Jaiswal[22] deposed whatever knowledge I gained with respect to disputed site is based on newspaper reports or what others told (other experts). She said she prepared a report on the Babri dispute on basis of discussions with medieval history expert in my department.

  • Supriya Verma[23], another expert who challenged the ASI excavations, had not read the ground penetration radar survey report that led the court to order an excavation. She did her PhD under another expert Shireen F Ratnagar.

  • Verma and Jaya Menon[24] alleged that pillar bases at the excavated site had been planted but HC found they were not present at the time the actual excavation took place.

  • Archaeologist Shereen F Ratnagar has written the introduction to the book of another expert who deposed, Professor Mandal. She admitted she had no field experience.

Normally, courts do not make adverse comments on the deposition of a witness and suffice it to consider whether it is credible or not, but we find it difficult to resist ourselves in this particular case considering the sensitivity and nature of dispute and also the reckless and irresponsible kind of statements…[25] the judge noted. He said opinions had been offered without making a proper investigation, research or study in the subject. The judge said he was startled and puzzled by contradictory statements.When expert witness Suraj Bhan deposed on the Babri mosque, the weight of his evidence was contradicted by anotherexpert for Muslim parties, Shirin Musavi, who told the court that Bhan is an archaeologist and not an expert on medieval history[26]. Justice Agarwal noted that instead of helping in making a cordial atmosphere it tends to create more complications, conflict and controversy. He pointed out that experts carry weight with public opinion.

When the matter is subjudice, one has to obey law: It is a simple matter that whenever, any issue / case is pending with the Court, as the matter is subjudice, it should not be discussed or the decisions cannot be drawn in favour of anybody. However, these left historians etc., have been always speaking and writing supporting for Muslim cause or against Hindus, as is evident from their own recorded / printed statements / articles always published in the selected in few journals / ndewspapers. Unfortunately, they have even agreed to be witnesses for the Wakf Board in the Allahabad Court as their names are figuring. Ironivcally, they are called as Sunni Wakf Board experts![27]

When religions rely upon belief system, so also secularism historians too belive so ignoring objectivity: Like believers and dis-believers historians too believe and compel others to believe their perspective without any objectivity. As their objectivity differes, their perspective also differ, but try to argue with ideology, as could be understood by others. With belief system, no two ideologists could come together; with objectivity no two historians could accept the same historical event in the same view or pwerspective; here, the media has been projecting only one view. So what about the other view and why the media does not provide opportunity to accommodate their view? Should “audi alteram partem – hear the other side and decide” be applicable only to the Courts according to the principle of natural justice or the historians do not want to follow?

The same pattern as noted in the case of DK, DMK and other rapid atheists and radical experts is noted in the case of these eminent historians or Sunni Wakf Board experts: As it is pointed out in the case of DK[28]-DMK[29] radicals and rabid atheist groups that they do not come to Courts or face courts, though, they used to cry and roar that they are not afraid of Courts and so on. Here, also, suppressing the facts, these historians talk and write one thing in the dailies and cover up their mumbling and bungling in the court. The court recordings of the witnesses have been actually exposing their hollowness of expertise, deceptiveness of historical knowledge and their dubious role as witnesses. That they accuse even without seeing, even without reading or just discussing with others etc, prove their capacity of manoeuvring and manipulation of academics. How they get PhDs etc., only prove such academic degradation and professional pampering without any shame or remorse. It is open secret that the JNU, AMU, DU, IHC, ICHR and others at one side and BMAC, Sunni Wakf Board, AIMPLB at the other side have been playing communalism under the guise of secularism. Just by accusing others they cannot live, survive and continue their careers in this competitive world.

Why the eminent historians and Sunni Wakf Board experts did not respond to the remarks of the Judge? Definitely, the remarks of the Judge have been questioning the integrity of the eminent historians and Sunni Wakf Board experts, who deposed before the court as witnesses! They cannot simply brush aside such exposure, as it casts aspersion on their position. The English reading Indians and Indian students may doubt their veracity, reliability and uprightness, as they read their writings or listen to them. Therefore, they should go to court to clear the mess instead of shooting out letters to the Chief Justice just like politicians.

Indians and Indian youth should note as to whether these Sunni Board experts should teach history. Very often, it is said, claimed and propagated that India is / has been secular. Yes, how then the eminent historians professional archaeologists acted as Sunni Wakf Board experts and deposed as witnesses to the Muslims? Why these retired historians, senile professors and their working agents always make clamor about history, historicity and historiography in India, as if they are the sole selling agents of such stuff? Nowadays, the fact is that a few have been takers for history and most of the universities have dispensed with history subject. Definitely, the so-called historians have lost their importance and thus they tried to struggle for survival with the political and communal support. Now, the documents are available to all and the facts are known to everybody who access them through internet or otherwise. Common people may not know or understand the deceptive talkings and writings of the eminent historians or Sunni Wakf Board experts, but slowly they come to know. They easily understand that who want to settle the dispute and who want to continue the dispute for their stakes. Definitely, Muslims and Hindus want to settle the issue once for all, but these history gamblers and politicians want to continue. Therefore, the will of people prevail.

Vedaprakash

16-10-2010


 

[2] Romila Thapar, “Where fusion cannot work – faith and history” (the Hindu, dated September 28, 2007).

…………………., Historical Memory without History, in Economic and Political weekly, VOL 42 No. 39 September 29 – October 05, 2007, pp.3903-3905.

K. N. Panikkar, Myth, history and politics, Frontline, October 5, 2007, pp.21-24.

Suraj Bhan, “Government should have stood by ASI”, Ibid, pp.19-20.

[4] During the 2007-IHC session, Suvira Jaiswal was making such satatements. Then, in Delhi also they tried take up the matter. Now, in February 2011 at Malda, they may raise the issue. However, the Indians have to weait and see.

[5] In “the Hindu”, as usual, the news appeared with her photo and all, but after that everbody would have forgot about it! However, their warrior-like talk, veiled threatening and tactics of suppression of facts cannot be acquired by others.

[6] The Hindu, ASI report should be made public, says appeal to Chief Justice, Published: October 14, 2010 01:54 IST | Updated: October 14, 2010 02:03 IST; http://www.hindu.com/2010/10/14/stories/2010101464751800.htm

[7] How this has been a blatant lie has been exposed by the judge and that is why these guys have now tried to save their image by writing such letters. Of course, the media gives due publicity to such hypes and gimmicks.

[8] However, their mumbling, jumbling and bungling deposes before the Court have been kept as closed secret!

[9] Thus the eminent historians look for a non-vegetarian kitchen of Muslims there instrad of a temple. The same experts declared that the 16” inscription was planted by the Karsevaks in 1992.

[10] When Bharatiya Itihasa Sankalana Samiti works on the same lines, the same eminent historians make fun of having such diversified experts, but now they themselves have such signatories, just to project their strength.

[11] The Hindu, Published: October 2, 2010 00:41 IST | Updated: October 2, 2010.

[12] There is nothing new in Romila’s argument, as she repeats the same matter again and again. The unfortunate thing is that she like her friends always want others should accept their views!

[13] How they contradict in their views legally can be noted in such statements. When convenience comes, they forget law, when law is against them, they start talking generalization or raise the bogey of “Hindutva”!

[14] Law precedence is created in the Court. Yes, definitely, the judges are the persons to create and others have to accept. Of course, the appealable legal remedy is there.

[15] But whatever happened also cannot be forgotten. When the same historians want to whitewash the temple destruction of the Muslims and accept only the Muslim contribution, such type of exclusivist logic is not explained. Why the students should not know the facts? In law it is said audi alteram partem – hear the other side and decide. How then historians want to decide without knowing the other side?

[16] Why then the interpretation of the past is always different for different historians? Nowadays, historians do not want objectivity also. How then they woerry about accuracy, when they themselves are not worried about it?

[17] Acts and Rules are within the time frame work. All know that Places of Worship Act is there and it e3xempts only this place and not others. Why then they talk about pre-1947 and after 1947, when law its4elf  cannot do so?

[18]The Hindu, Historical evidence ignored, say historians, dated October 1, 2010, http://www.thehindu.com/news/national/article805087.ece

[23] It is interesting to note that the ASI report talks about a shrine followed by a temple with different structural phases, it also talks of “animal bones recovered from various levels of different periods”. If any shrine and a temple existed how can anyone account for the animal bones, Supriya Verma asks? She also maintains that stones and decorated bricks could have been used in any building, not necessarily only in a temple. Also, the carved architectural members have come from the debris and not from the stratified context.

[24] She got appointment in the AMU after she started supporting the cause of mosque and appeared as Sunni Wakf Board expert!

[25] The historians who deposed as witnesses and as well as others should carefully read this and understand their postion. They cannot pretend as if nothing happened or pose as great authorities and roam here and there in historical forums and conferences. Now Indians have also understood their double-games, double-speak and double-standards.

[26] Nowadays, just like medical experts or specialized doctors, these historians ad archaeologists trading charges like this – so-and-so is an expert in that field and he alone can know the truth and others cannot know the truth. Such type of exclusive mind-set exposes their arrogance and weakness and not the real expertise.

[27]Asghar ali Engineer, Archaeological Excavations and Temple, September 1-15, 2003,  http://www.csss-isla.com/arch%20150.htm

[28] Vedaprakash, Old Judgments and  New thoughts in the present context: S. Veerabadran Chettiar vs E. V. Ramaswami Naicker  others., http://vedaprakash.indiainteracts.in/2008/08/09/old-judgments-and-new-thoughts-in-the-present-context-s-veerabadran-chettiar-vs-e-v-ramaswami-naicker-others/

Karunanidhi way of Meddling with Chronology and History – II

January 17, 2010

Karunanidhi way of Meddling with Chronology and History: Part – II

Vedaprakash

In Indian history, there have been instances, where the Mohammedans and Christians had meddled with Indian chronology and history.

In that notorious meddling tradition, the dravidian concoctor, meddler and forger – Karunanidhi has joined and spoliing everything.

I have already pointed out in my earlier posting as to how this senile man has stooped down to concoct the tradition, heritage and civilization:

http://vedaprakash.indiainteracts.com/2008/04/29/karunanidhi-way-of-meddling-with-chronology-and-history/

Karunanidhi way of Meddling with Chronology and History
Published on April 29th, 2008 In Blogging, Careers-Life, Parties, Philosophy, Writing-Poetry, Politics | Views 95

However, he has determined to play mischief, as evidenced from his nonsensical talk made as appearing in “Viduthalai”.

கிருஷ்ணனுக்கும் – நாரதிக்கும் பிறந்த 60 குழந்தைகள் –
தமிழ் ஆண்டுகள் என்றால் ஏற்றுக்கொள்ள முடியுமா?
“தமிழ்ப் புத்தாண்டை”க் கோலாகலமாகக் கொண்டாடுவோம்!

http://files.periyar.org.in/viduthalai/20090116/news02.html

http://files.periyar.org.in/viduthalai/20090116/thalai.html

முதல்வர் கலைஞரின் இன எழுச்சியுரை

சென்னை, ஜன. 16- தைமுதல் நாள் தமிழ்ப் புத்தாண்டுபற்றியும், இதுவரை இருந்துவந்த தமிழ்ப் புத்தாண்டுபற்றியும் முதல்வர் கலைஞர் அவர்கள் எடுத்துரைத்தும், தைமுதல் நாள் புத் தாண்டை சிறப்பாகக் கொண்டாட வேண்டும் என்று வலியுறுத்தியும் இன எழுச்சியுரையாற்றினார்.

கருணாநிதி கலைவாணர் அரங்கத்தில் நடைபெற்ற திருவள்ளுவர் திருநாள் மற்றும் தமிழக அரசின் விருதுகள் வழங்கும் விழாவில், விருது பெறும் ஒவ்வொருவருக்கும் விருதுத் தொகை ஒரு இலட்ச ரூபாய் பொற்கிழி வழங்கி, தங்கப் பதக்கம் அணிவித்துச் சிறப்பு செய்து, சிறந்த நூலாசிரியர்களுக்கும், பதிப்பகத்தார்க்கும் பரிசுகள் வழங்கி, அகவை முதிர்ந்த தமிழறிஞர்களுக்கு நிதியுதவி ஆணைகள் வழங்கி, விழாச் சிறப்புரையாற்றினார்கள். இவ்விழாவில், மாண்புமிகு நிதியமைச்சர் பேராசிரியர் க. அன்பழகன், மாண்புமிகு செய்தித்துறை அமைச்சர் பரிதி இளம்வழுதி மற்றும் முக்கியப் பிரமுகர்கள் கலந்துகொண்டனர்

தமிழ்ப் புத்தாண்டு தொடங்குகின்ற இந்த நாளில் – நேற்றையதினம் புத்தாண்டு – ஏழையெளியவர்களுக்கு எல்லாம் – எல்லோருக்கும் சமத்துவப் பொங்கல் சாப்பிட இந்த அரசின் சார்பாக அவர்களுக்கெல்லாம் தேவையான பொருட்களை வழங்கிய அரசு – இந்த அரசு – இந்தப் புத்தாண்டை இதற்கு முன்பு நாம் கொண்டாடினோம். வருடப் பிறப்பு என்ற பெயரால் கொண்டாடினோம். அந்த வருடப் பிறப்பு எப்படி புத்தாண்டாக மாற நேரிட்டது என்றால் – தந்தை பெரியார் போன்றவர்கள், பேரறிஞர் அண்ணா போன்றவர்கள், புரட்சிக் கவிஞர் பாரதி தாசன் போன்றவர்கள், மறைமலை அடிகளார் போன்றவர்கள், திரு.வி.க. போன்றவர்கள் அத்தனை பேரும் சேர்ந்து – நம்முடைய தமிழனுக்கு ஒரு ஆண்டு வேண்டும், அந்தத் தமிழ் ஆண்டு, புத்தாண்டு தை முதல் நாளாகத் தான் இருக்க முடியும், தை பிறந்தால் வழி பிறக்கும் என்று அந்தச் சொல் வந்ததற்குக் காரணமே, தை பிறந்தால் தான் தமிழனுக்கு, ஏழைக்கு, விவசா யிக்கு, உழவனுக்கு, பாட்டாளிக்கு வாழ்வு பிறக்கின்றது. ஆகவே அந்த நாளை நாம் புத்தாண்டு என்று வைப்போம் என்று வைத்தார்கள். அதற்கு முன்பு இருந்த புத்தாண்டு, வருடப்பிறப்பு – அது வேறு, இது வேறு. அய்யோ, அதை ஒழித்து விட்டீர்களே என்று யாராவது சொன்னால், நீங்கள் கேளுங்கள். நீ எந்த வருடம் பிறந்தாய் என்று – என்னையே கேளுங்கள் -அவர்களுடைய கணக்குப்படி-நான் ரக்தாட்சி வருடம் பிறந்தேன். அப்படியென் றால் இப்போது எனக்கு என்ன வயது? ரக்தாட்சி வருடம் பிறந்த வனுக்கு அட்சய வருடத்தில் என்ன வயது என்று கேட்டால், ரக்தாட்சி, குரோதன, அட்சய – ஒரு வருடம் – ஏனென்றால் அறுபது ஆண்டுகள் – பெயர்கள் சுற்றிக் கொண்டே வரும். பிரபவ, விபவ, சுக்ல, பிரஜோபத்தி, ஆங்கீரச, ஸ்ரீமுக, பவ, யுவ, தாது, ஈஸ்வர, வெகுதான்ய, பிரமாதி, விக்கிரம, விஷூ, சித்திரபானு, சுபானு என்று இப்படி அறுபது ஆண்டுகள் சுற்றிக் கொண்டே வரும். அப்படி சுற்றிக் கொண்டு வரும்போது இந்த அறுபதில், 1924ஆம் ஆண்டு பிறந்த நாள் – இந்த வருடத்தின் சுற்று முடியும் போது – யாராலும் சரியாக வயதைக் கணக்கிட்டுச் சொல்ல முடியாது. 1924இல் பிறந்தவன் என்று சொல்கிற போது, இப்போது என்னுடைய வயது 85 என்று சொல்ல முடியும். எப்படி வந்தது இந்த வருஷம்.? ஒரு நாள் கிருஷ்ணனைப் பார்த்து நகர் வலம் வந்த நாரதர் – கிருஷ்ணா எனக்கொரு ஆசை என்றார். என்ன ஆசை நாரதா என்றார். நான் கதை சொல்லவில்லை. இது திரைக்கதை வசனம் அல்லவே அல்ல. இது திவ்யமான புராணம். அந்தப் புராணத் திலே நாரதர் வீணையோடு வந்து கொண்டிருந்தார். அப்போது கிருஷ்ணனிடம் எனக்கொரு ஆசை, அதை நீ நிறைவேற்ற வேண்டுமென்றார். ஒரு அழகான பெண்ணோடு நான் ஒரு நாளா வது வாழ வேண்டும் என்றார் நாரதர். கிருஷ்ணனுக்கு கோபம் வந்து விட்டது. இவர் யார், நாம் யார்? நம்மைப் பார்த்து இப்படி கேட்கிறாரே என்று, சரி உனக்கு நான் இந்த வரம் தருகிறேன், நீ இந்த ஊரில் எல்லா வீடுகளுக்கும் போ, எந்த வீட்டிலேயாவது அழகான ஒரு பெண் உனக்காக இருந்தால், நீ அவளை ஏற்றுக் கொள்ளத் தடை இல்லை, அவள் உன்னோடு வருவாள், போ என்று அனுப்பி வைத்தார். நாரதர் போனார். ஒவ்வொரு வீட்டி லும் ஒரு புருஷனோடு பெண் இருந்தாளே தவிர, தனியாக ஒரு பெண்கூட இல்லை. திரும்பி வந்தார் நாரதர். ஏன் என்று கிருஷ்ணர் கேட்டார். எல்லா வீடுகளிலும் பெண், ஆணோடு தான் இருக்கிறாள், அதனால் எனக்கேற்ற பெண் எங்கும் கிடைக்கவில்லை, என்னை விரும்புகிற பெண்ணையே காணவில்லை என்றார். சரி என்ன செய்யச் சொல்றே? நானே பெண்ணாக ஆகி விடுகிறேன், நீ ஆணாக இருந்து என்னை சந்தோஷப்படுத்து என்று நாரதர் கிருஷ்ணனைக் கேட்கிறார்.

ஒரே நாளில் 60 பிள்ளைகள்

சரி உன் இஷ்டப்படியே ஆகட்டும் என்று நாரதரைப் பெண்ணாக்கி, நாரதர், நாரதியாகி – கிருஷ்ணன் நாரதர் இரண்டு பேரும் சந்தோஷமாக இருந்து – அதைத் தான் படம் பார்த்திருப்பீர்கள் – பல ஆண்டுகளுக்கு முன்பு திரைப்படம் வந்தது – பாட்டிகளுக்கெல்லாம் தெரியும் – கிருஷ்ணன் நாரதி என்று படமே வந்தது. நான் பொய் சொல்லவில்லை. அவர்கள் இருவருக்கும் சேர்ந்து 60 பிள்ளைகள் பிறந்தன. கடவுளுடைய காதல் அல்லவா? அவர்கள் இருவருக்கும் ஒரே நாளில் அறுபது பிள்ளைகள் பிறந்தன. அந்த அறுபது பிள்ளைகளுக்கும் வைத்த பெயர்கள் தான் பிரபவ, விபவ, சுக்ல என்று ஆரம்பித்து அட்சய வரையிலே உள்ள வருடங்களின் பெயர்கள். அந்த வருடங்கள் தான், அந்தக் கடவுளர்கள் தான், நமக்கு ஒவ்வொரு ஆண்டிற்கும் வைக்கப்படுகிற வருடங்கள், ஆண்டுகள் என்றிருந்தால் தமிழன் அதை ஏற்றுக் கொள்ள முடியுமா? அவன் தமிழனாக இருக்க முடியுமா? தமிழனாக இருப்பதற்கு அவனுக்கு எப்படி ஒரு கலை, கலாச்சாரம், நாகரிகம், பண்பாடு இவைகள் எல்லாம் வேண்டுமோ – பண்பாடு வேண்டும், அவனுக்கு வருடம் வேண்டாமா? அவனுக்கு ஒரு ஆண்டு வேண்டாமா? அவனுக்கு ஒரு திங்கள் வேண்டாமா? மாதம் வேண்டாமா? கிழமை வேண்டாமா? அதைத் தான் ஆய்ந்தாய்ந்து 500-க்கு மேற்பட்ட புலவர்கள் கூடி, 1921ஆம் ஆண்டு எடுத்த முடிவு தான், நேற்றையதினம் நாம் கொண்டாடிய நாள், தமிழர் புத்தாண்டு நாள் – இந்த ஆண்டு நாம் இதை ஓரளவு மகிழ்ச்சியோடுதான் கொண்டாடியிருக்கிறோம். ஏனென்றால் தமிழர்கள் வேறு ஒரு பக்கத்திலே சங்கடப்பட்டுக் கொண்டிருக்கிற நேரத்தில் நம்மால் அவ்வளவு தான் கொண்டாட முடிந்தது. அந்தத் தமிழர்களுக் காக நாம் இங்கே அந்த விழாவினை ஓரளவு தான் கொண்டாடி னோம்.

அடுத்த ஆண்டுமுதல்….

அடுத்த ஆண்டிலேயிருந்து அமெரிக்க சுதந்திர தினம் எப்படிக் கொண்டாடப்படுகிறதோ – இங்கிலாந்திலே எப்படி சுதந்திரம் தினம் கொண்டாடப்படுகிறதோ அதைப் போலவே தமிழர்களுடைய ஆண்டு தினம் – முதல்நாளைக் கொண்டாட வேண்டும். கடற்கரையிலே வாண வேடிக்கைகள் – ஒவ்வொரு மாவட்டத்தின் தலை நகரத்திலும் – குளக்கரையிலே, தெருக் களிலே, மைதானங்களிலே வான வேடிக்கைகள் நடைபெற வேண்டும். அப்படி கோலாகலமாக இந்த விழாவை நாம் கொண்டாட வேண்டும் என்று கேட்டுக்கொண்டு, விருது வழங்கப்பட்ட இந்த விழாவிலே இந்த விளக்கங்களைத் தருவதற்கு நேரம் கிடைத்த காரணத்தால் உங்களையெல்லாம் சந்திக்கின்ற வாய்ப்பு கிடைத்த காரணத்தால் – என் நோய் பறந்தது என்ற எண்ணத்தோடு மகிழ்ச்சியைத் தெரிவித்துக் கொள்கிறேன்.

One should have the knowledge of astronomy, mathematics and connected textual knowledge to understand any subject matter.

We were taught that the “earth was like that of the shape of an orange” to impress upon that its polar diameter is lesser than that of equitorial diameter. Thus, we do not still believe that the earth has neither the shape nor the size that of an orange.

We were taught about atoms as “indivisible” based on Dalton”s atomic theory. But, many years later Rutherford, Bohr and others disproved with their experiments that “atom” can be divided into sumatomic particles like proton, neutron, electron, neutrino etc. Thus, the word “atom” has become redundant and meaningless, however, as Western / Greek legacy, we still use.

However, here, the attempt of Karunanidhi has been shere idiotic, mischievous and spiteful, as he has been bent upon to malign Indian tradition, heritage and culture.

He should have some basics when he knows to mention the names of the so-called 60 years!

Jupiter conjoins Saturn in 19.859 years at an advance of about 123 degrees. After three conjunctions, 59.577 years, it recurs at a mean advance of 8.93° – the first order recurrence cycle of Jupiter-Saturn. With this 9-degree advance every 60 years, in 40 conjunctions the advance moves around the circle and in 794.37 years returns to within 0.93° of the starting point – the second order recurrence cycle. This 1° discrepancy would thus locate a third order recurrence cycle in 360 times 800 years, roughly speaking, a period too far in excess of recorded history to be useful as a frame of reference.

The cycle of Jupiter now in general use is a cycle of sixty years, the samvatsaras of which bear certain special names, Prabhava, Vibhava, Sukla, Pramoda, “c., again in accordance with certain rules. This cycle exists in three varieties. According to the original constitution of this cycle, the samvatsaras are determined as in the second or mean-sign variety of the 12-years cycle: each samvatsara commences when Jupiter enters a sign of the zodiac with reference to his mean motion and longitude; and it lasts for slightly more than 361.02 days. This variety is traced back in inscriptional records to A.D. 602, and is still used in Northern India.The names of 60-year Jupiter cycle are found in the South Indian inscriptions – Chalukaya.

Mere rhetoric cannot serve the purpose.

Senility may be a trait of, relating to, exhibiting, or characteristic of old age <senile weakness> ; especially : exhibiting a loss of cognitive abilities (as memory) associated with old age, but, here in his case, it cannot be accepted as he talks nonsense, only when anything Indian / Hindu has to be attacked, he has been very clear.

Romila Thapar, Duke University, Methodist Church or Romila Thapar, Secularism, Secular history: The Role of Historian and Social Change!

July 16, 2009
Romila Thapar, Duke University, Methodist Church or Romila Thapar, Secularism, Secular history: The Role of Historian and Social Change!
Published on October 23rd, 2007 In Uncategorized, Politics |  Views 410
Romila Thapar, Duke University, Methodist Church orRomila Thapar, Secularism, Secular history: The Role of Historian and Social Change! I am happy to know that, “The Historian in the World: A Conversation with John Hope Franklin and Romila Thapar” will take place at 3 p.m. in the Divinity School’s Goodson Chapel on Duke’s West Campus. It is free and open to the public. Srinivas Aravamudan, director of the John Hope Franklin Humanities Institute, will moderate the discussion”. http://www.dukenews .duke.edu/ 2007/10/conversa tion.htmlI am more anxious what the historians discuss there in the Divinity School’s Goodson Chapel on Duke’s West Campus on October 22, 2007!

“the DivinitySchool’s Goodson Chapel on Duke’s West Campus” made me curious to look into the details. The University claims that, “The Duke University is related the Methodist Church”.

For details see: “Duke University”s Relation to the Methodist Church”:  http://library.duke.edu/uarchives/history/duke-umchh.html

  •      Well, it is all right, bt how the reportedly Communist or Marxist, progressive, secuar Romila Thapar would be speaking there in the, “the Divinity School’s Goodson Chapel on Duke’s West Campus”?
  •      How “Two distinguished scholars will share their views of the role of the historian and social change”?
  •      Would they discuss within the Charter, bylaws, aims, and mission statement” or they go beyond?

The “Charter, bylaws, aims, and mission statement” contains a provision, as follows:

The aims of Duke University are to assert a faith in the eternal union of knowledge and religion set forth in the teachings and character of Jesus Christ, the Son of God; to advance learning in all lines of truth; to defend scholarship against all false notions and ideals; to develop a Christian love of freedom and truth; to promote a sincere spirit of tolerance; to discourage all partisan and sectarian strife; and to render the largest permanent service to the individual, the state, the nation, and the church. Unto these ends shall the affairs of this University always be administered”.http://library.duke.edu/uarchives/history/charterlink.html

How Ropmila Thapar hailing from “Secular India” is going to be accommodative, conducive and recptive to such Christians principles in the name of Jesus Christ? This makes me remember as to how the Christian Crusades, marriages and other functions are held at the “Periyar Tidal” (auditourium with big hall) at Chennai, India. The podium / stage there bear the Cross-believing Christians and the atheists, who speak against the God, scriptures and believers! Like that, would the “the Divinity School’s Goodson Chapel on Duke’s West Campus” bear the secular, progressive and sectarian Romila Thapar there in the name of Jesus Christ, the Son of God?

Just remember, what she wrote about Jesus Christ, when she was accusing Rama, the Hindu God as a myth:

This does not happen with the biographies of those who were known to be historical figures and who founded belief systems: the Buddha, Jesus Christ, Mohammad. Their biographies adhere largely to a single story-line and this helps to endorse the ‘official’ narrative of their life. Their existence is recorded in other sources as well that are not just narratives of their lives but have diverse associations…..”.

At that time, I had responded as follows:

Their biographies adhere largely to a single story-line and this helps to endorse the ‘official’ narrative of their life.Why they should largely adhere to a single line? How this helps “official” narrative? How “official” it could be of “their life”? Why can’t you write as a historian instead of believer here? That the “biographers” were compelled or forced to accept or adhere to a single line proves that many lines were left out. And still small number of biographers who did not adhere to a single line is also exposed. Then, what you are talking about? Majority view and minority view? Condemn the “lesser” and accept or approve the Larger”! Adhere to one-line and forget many lines! What sort of historian you are? That man Karu has become a senile man and talks differently. Do you also do the same think as a senile lady?How you endorse such one-liners? Is there any historical methodology to that effect? Which University teaches such approving of one-line biography by eminent historians like you?Do not fool Indians. Ernest Renan, J. M. Robertson and so many reputed authorities are there on the subject matter of Jesus Christ and Christianity. Any way, it is your cowardice gets exposed, as you never whispered anything, when there was much Christian opposition to screening of “Da Vinci Code”. However, when the so-called “Hindutva judgment” came out, you vociferously jumped and asserted that “We would go to Court”. Everything appeared in “the Hindu” itself with your face. Madam, what happened? But now you come siding with atheists, anti-Hindus, anti-nationals as a historian suppressing the recent past and forgetting your own past!

Their existence is recorded in other sources as well that are not just narratives of their lives but have diverse associations. So also Rama. Why then your argument goes differently.In fact, their associations differ. But, Ramayana core story, as H. D. Sankalia in his “Ramayana Myth or Reality”  that it had been there nearly for 3000 years.How “That their existences is recorded in other sources” help you to decide?

It may be noted that historians and scholars have pointed out that Christ story was copied from
Krishna! Rama was repeatedly mentioned in different literature not because of variance, but influence and impact created on the people well before 2500-3000 YBP. Was the Sangam poet a fool to record in his poem about his discussion with his army about the mode of crossing over the ocean to Lanka”. How that poet was imaging that that Lanka should have been the Lanka of Ramayana in his times i.e, 2500 – 3000 YBP?”

Definitely, the Americans and American Christian believers might be knowing about the background and the implications revoving around the discussion. So, we Indians are eagerly waiting to see as to how tshe is going to discuss within the conditions of the University and Christian belief system or she would have courage to vent our her genuine feeling as sjhe has been doing here in India against Hindus. As she has recently started supporting the atheist political party DK-DMK-PMK combine of the ruling combine (supported by the Communist-Marxist political parties from outside), we look forward the discussion to fulfil the following conditions:

The aims of Duke University are to assert a faith in the eternal union of knowledge and religion set forth in the teachings and character of Jesus Christ, the Son of God; V     to advance learning in all lines of truth; to defend scholarship against all false notions and ideals; to develop a Christian love of freedom and truth; V     to promote a sincere spirit of tolerance; to discourage all partisan and sectarian strife; and V     to render the largest permanent service to the individual, the state, the nation, and the church.

Unto these ends shall the affairs of this University always be administered

The activities of Duke foundation have been obviously Christian:

For details: click and see http://www.dukeendowment.org/ruralchurch

VEDAPRAKASH

22-10-2007.