Archive for the ‘Jesus Christ’ Category

Didde Ebenezer, pastor sexploits women from 2015 onwards – Victims come out, complaint filed, but escaped, secular media, women activists and tolerant groups keep quite!

October 20, 2017

Didde Ebenezer, pastor sexploits women from 2015 onwards – Victims come out, complaint filed, but escaped, secular media, women activists and tolerant groups keep quite!

Pastor Didde Ebenezer, Tadepalligudem mandal

The sexual crimes of Christian clergy in India: In India, the sexploitation of Christian priests have been increasing, alarming and nauseating, but, the media has been callously silent and indifferent. All sorts of sex violations, in fact leading murders and other serious crimes, have been reported, but, only few booked, adjudicated and jailed, whereas, most of others have been roaming with their frocks of different colours.  About Ram Rahim, the media blared, though, he has been a secular sexploiter. Had he been Hindu, the situation be different. After him, now comes Didde Ebenezer from Andhra. He has been virtually raping women for the last two years. Though Telugu media and local people have exposed, he has been roaming unscathed. The influence, he has with church or politics is inexplicable and not known.

Pastor Didde Ebenezer, women commission chief

On Deepavali day, complaint lodged by AP Women’s Commission chairperson: Didde Ebenezer has been evidently notorious and the victims exposed him. Expressing concern over the way a pastor allegedly subjected young women to sexual exploitation, AP Women’s Commission chairperson Nannapaneni Rajakumari, during her visit to Jagannadhapuram village of Tadepalligudem mandal in West Godavari on 18-10-2017 [Wednesday], instructed the police to arrest him and rescue four women reportedly confined by him[1]. Several women narrated to Ms Rajakumari how they were victimised by pastor Didde Ebenezer under the guise of running a Church at Jagannadhapuram[2]. “He would start by asking us to do simple things like giving him a massage, and then move his way up to more unspeakable actions. He would say that we have to follow whatever he says, or else something evil would befall us, no matter how disgusting his demand is,” a victim told media persons. Another victim alleged that the pastor was organise ‘special prayers’ and make women stand in the nude, in candle light. They also claimed that four women were under confinement with the pastor at present. The locals also alleged that the pastor’s male relatives also indulged in acts with women in the village. In other words, mass sex exploitation has been going in the name of god, church and divine activities.

Pastor Didde Ebenezer, Tadepalligudem mandal- TV9 video

Since 2015, Didde Ebenezer has been raping women: The victims informed the chairperson that the alleged misbehaviour of the pastor with young women was exposed in 2015 and a police case was booked. He has been exploiting women assuring them to make them to talk with God directly. However, for such divine exigency, certain rituals had to be followed, he insisted and explained to convince them. The poor women fell to his assurance and desire to talk with God agreed to be with him. Initially, he used to request favours like messaging his legs, hands, head and so on. Then, he used remove his shirt and asked them to message his back and front. In this way, indirectly, he induced them to develop instinct to have sex with him. Thus, he has been exploiting women regularly. In the house, where he was reportedly carried on such activities, used “Nirodh” packets were also found. Even after complaining to police, the women refused to return with parents. For this, one doctor explained that the women were mesmerized through some acts, so that they wanted to be with him only[3]. Moreover, they might have been drugged also, though he could not tell with confirmation, as such condition could be determined, only after testing. However, Ebenezer has been exploiting the women psychologically and physically.

Pastor Didde Ebenezer, Tadepalligudem mandal- Nirodh recovered

Nude prayers conducted with candle lit: The police made enquiries at the houses of the victims and others. According to the victims, the pastor was exposed in 2015 and a police case was booked. The man, however, reportedly managed to get the case struck off in a local court with his influence, they alleged. In one case, he promised to marry a victim, but later refused. He tried to settle with her in a different manner. This was revealed by her narration to TV9 channel[4]. Later, he shifted his accommodation to Madhuru village to avoid trouble at Jagannadhapuram village. This is also evidently to avoid the legal implications of jurisdiction and all. The victims said that the pastor was targeting good looking young women and was even organising candle-lit prayers with the women in the nude[5]. The Tamil media also carried the story[6]. Obviously, it has been picked up from Deccan Herald[7]. Though, the media has not explained the significance of “nude worship”, it is detailed below in the Chriatian context.  They informed her that four women were under confinement with the pastor at present.

Pastor Didde Ebenezer,victim- modus operandi-TV9 video

Victims explained how they were sexploited: Shocked at the ordeal of the women victims, Ms Rajakumari called up West Godavari SP M. Ravi Prakash and instructed him to arrest the pastor and get the four women released and handed over to the Women’s Commission. “We will immediately take him into custody, and free the women who are allegedly under confinement. We all had tears in our eyes when we heard the victims speak. This is not a normal incident. He has played with people’s life in a holy place like a church. We will prosecute him,” Rajakumari told locals, after the public meeting[8]. West Godavari Joint Collector said[9], “The allegations are shocking. We will ensure that he loses the title of ‘pastor’ and take strict action against him. We will find all the people responsible for the incident and assure action against all of them.” Later, she assured the women that she would fight on the issue until all the victims get justice. She said that as Chief Minister N. Chandrababu Naidu was on a foreign tour, she would take it up to his notice to take stern action against the erring pastor after his return to the state.

Pastor Didde Ebenezer, victim complains - many-TV9 video

Why Andhra infested with Christian sexploitation?: Meanwhile, a group of supporters of the pastor raised slogans in his favour claiming that he is a good person. They refuted the charges against him as fabricated. Using the church as his shield Andhra Pradesh pastor Didde Ebenezer committed a lot of crimes. Chief among them being sexually exploiting young girls and women of his parish, another newspaper pointed out[10]. It added that[11]Earlier in September, there was another case of pastor abuse. The Renigunta rural police arrested Pastor Panneer Selvam, 54, for abusing a  minor near his house and allegedly forced himself on her.” That is why Andhra has been infested with the Christian sexploitation for many years has to be probed. Coming to Ebenezer, He does much publicity for himself and claims that[12] “he cares for HIV/AIDS through the social media Team members: Pastor.D.Ebenezer Didde, somebody”! So none knows that “nobody”. Evidently, he must have been wealthy enough to cover up everything and everybody to escape from the complaints and court proceedings.

Nude worship allowed in Christianity - Mail online

Why Nude worship in Church and how it is allowed?: In 21st century, one should ask as to how the nude worship is allowed in church and the Christians approve it. It is evident that it is allowed in USA under the guise of theology. Pastor Allen Parker, the leader of White Tail Chapel in the town of Southampton, said he came to the decision to allow naked worship after concluding the clothing requirements of other churches were overly ‘pretentious’, and decided his own flock should be free to forgo such materialism if they desire[13]. He believes he is in good company too, claiming many of the most important moments in the Bible happened while the protagonists were nude, including Jesus’ crucifixion and resurrection[14]. Speaking to CNN, Parker said: ‘When he [Jesus] was born he was naked, when he was crucified he was naked and when he arose he left his clothes in the tomb and he was naked.’ ‘If God made us that way, how can that be wrong?’ he added.

Nude worship allowed in Christianity - theology

Nudity started from Genesis and hence Christians can indulge in nude worship: Parker is believed to have drawn at least some of his opinions on nudity from the book of Genesis, in which Adam and Eve were originally described as ‘both naked, the man and his wife, and were not ashamed’. It was only after sinfully eating forbidden fruit from the Tree of Knowledge that Adam and Even are said to have seen their nudity as shameful, at which point they sowed fig leaves into loincloths. Although the church allows worshipers to attend services fully naked, many have decided they would rather continue to attend fully clothed, particuarly when in mid-winter, while others opt to just reveal their breasts or genitals. The idea is that nudity is ‘the great equaliser’, reminding all those gathered in the church that they are simple human beings and that, beneath any personal wealth or glamorous outward appearance, they are all more of less the same beneath the clothing. ‘There’s not a feeling that you have to be better than one another, physically. We’re humans, we have scars, we have what we have. It’s learning to love and accept that,’ Parker says.

Pastor Didde Ebenezer, Tadepalligudem mandal- Police enquiry

Christian Nude worship or mass sex exploitation or group sex – what has been going on?: But, how in India it is allowed is a question. In Karnataka, when women were practicing exclusively such worship without any controversy, the modernized persons made it controversy and banned it[15]. Here, ironically, the Christians not only tacitly accepting, but also justifying indirectly However, the sexploitation of many women nearly 20 as reported by the Telugu media by Ebenezer has been monstrous, gruesome and grotesque and cannot be allowed on any account. Strangely, all the liberals and torch bearers who give sermon on toleration and all are keeping quite. None could imagine that they do not read this news, as this has been going on for three years.

© Vedaprakash

20-10-2017

Pastor Didde Ebenezer, victim complains - many-TV9 video

[1] DECCAN CHRONICLE. Rajahmundry: Arrest pastor for abusing girls, Published Oct 19, 2017, 6:32 am IST; UpdatedOct 19, 2017, 6:32 am IST.

[2] http://www.deccanchronicle.com/nation/crime/191017/rajahmundry-arrest-pastor-for-abusing-girls.html

[3] Rapist Pastor || Victims demands stringent action || TV9 Effect, for details, see at: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lkhL41mu3d8

[4] AP Pastor’s dirty secrets exposed || TV9 Special Focus, For details, see at: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNE4bkt6B44

[5] Church Pastor sexual harassment on Women at West Godavari | CVR News, for details se at:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CkWfPFiwQZ8

[6] தினகரன், ஆந்திர மாநிலத்தில் பரபரப்பு நிர்வாண பிரார்த்தனை செய்தால் கடவுள் ஏற்பார் என பாலியல் தொல்லை, 2017-10-20@ 00:59:03.

[7] http://www.dinakaran.com/News_Detail.asp?Nid=344197

[8] TheNewsMinute, Women tell tales of abuse by village church pastor to Andhra women’’s commission chief, Thursday, October 19, 2017. 09.16 IST.

[9] http://www.thenewsminute.com/article/women-tell-tales-abuse-village-church-pastor-andhra-womens-commission-chief-70211

[10] Asianet-newsable, Andhra pastor sexually abused women in the name of church, By Team Asianet Newsable | 01:47 PM October 19, 2017.

[11] http://newsable.asianetnews.com/andhra-pradesh/andhra-pastor-sexually-abused-women-in-the-name-of-evil-church

[12] https://in.linkedin.com/in/pastor-d-ebenezer-didde-5796a414

[13] Mail.online, ‘And they were naked – and not ashamed’: Church allows nude worship, by John Hall, Published: 09:34 BST, 11 Feb.2014, updated: 13.46 BST, March 6, 2016.

[14] http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2556548/And-naked-not-ashamed-Church-allows-nude-worship.html</p>

[15]The Hindu,  Nude worship banned, By Our Special Correspondent, Wednesday, Mar 05, 2003

SHIMOGA March 4. The Deputy Commissioner and District Magistrate, Tushar Girinath, has imposed ban orders in connection with the annual jatra of Renukamba at Chandragutti in Sorab taluk. The jatra is scheduled to be held from March 9 to 14. The ban has been imposed to prevent “bettale seve” (worship in the nude). The order bans the congregation of people during the jatra within a radius of 5 km. of the temple under the provisions of the Section 35 of the Karnataka Police Act. Mr. Girinath has allowed the performance of rites during the jatra. He has passed an order banning sale of liquor during the jatra time in a radius of 5 km. of the temple. The Chandragutti jatra was marred in 1986 when enthusiastic activists tried to stop the devotees from worshipping in the nude. The angry devotees retaliated. In the melee, volunteers and police personnel were attacked and paraded naked.

http://www.thehindu.com/2003/03/05/stories/2003030501410400.htm

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Hindu Maya and Christian Cyber-missions, evangelism and Implications

November 5, 2012

Hindu Maya and Christian Cyber-missions, evangelism and Implications

Iwrote this five years back anticipitating the Chritian propaganda unleashed through cyber-space with the blessings of MNCs. With the LPG, they target Indian society easily with their aggressive marketing capabilities using all methods without any code of ethics or morality. Considering the relevancy and context, I post this here without any change salvaging from Internet.

 Cyber-mission on war-path to attack India – the First Crusade may start at any time: On 30th July, 2007, John Dyal was interviewed by the NDTV news reader and repeatedly asked about the Catholic Cyber Conversion adopted and adapted recently. Reacting to this, vigorously and crazily John Dyal started justifying it. When persisted how religion could be brought to the virtual world, he blurted out that “Why not” – Hindus say that the entire world is Maya. Then, it was shown as if the TV crew get opinion of Delhi-students with Christian, half-Christian-half-Hindu and Hindu names accepting and supporting such Cyber-conversion, evidently without understanding the implications. Thus, it appears that Vatican has incorporated Cyber-mission in its agenda and there would be more Roberto de Nobilis, Beschis, Bede Griffiths, Hans Staffners, Clooneys, and so on with laptops with wireless internet connections. Of course, they started already.

 Definition of Cyber-crusade / Holy-War / Jihad: John Edmiston discussed about, “Missions in Cyberspace: The Strategic Front-Line Use Of The Internet In Missions“, in www.cybermissions.org. He claims: “One of these means is the use of theInternet. And one of the most exhilarating frontiers of mission today is cyber-missions; the frontline use of IT to evangelize and disciple the nations. In this article we will keep the focus on cross-cultural mission web sites and strategic approaches to ministry online such as web-evangelism, email discipleship, web-based TEE and icafes as a church-planting strategy. This paper will review the potential, the actual uses and the successful implementation of Internet-based missionary outreach and put the case for missionary societies to have an Internet evangelism department headed by a Field Director – Cyberspace. I have intentionally excluded the traditional uses of computing in missions or the use of the Internet for mono-cultural ministry as this has already been extensively reviewed elsewhere (for instance in the work of Leonard Sweet)” [the key words are given in colour].

 Hindus untochables or experts in Cyber-religion? Can Hindus match for this? Are they prepared to take? Yes, definitely, Hindus are capable considering the IT workers and experts in the field. But, the Christians think differently, if all these Hindu guys and girls are converted, what would happen to Hindu religion? Yes, with single stroke, they can strategically enslave the Cyber-untochables and John Daya & Co., would start fighting for them also starting a Cyber-Dalit Liberation Front, All India Cyber-SC-ST Federation for which D’Souza, Udit Raj and others  might be President, Secretary and so on sending reports to Bush, Bill Gates, Vatican, UN and what not.

 They give figures like this: Online Language Populations (September 2002): 

English 36.5%;Chinese 10.9%,

Japanese 9.7%,

Spanish 7.2%,

German 6.7%,

Korean 4.5%,
Italian 3.8%,
French 3.5%,Portuguese 3.0%,

Russian 2.9%,

Dutch 2.0% (Source: Global Reach)

We should have corresponding figures for users in Hindi, Tamil and other languages.The English includes, Hindu users also.

 

Warning – the anti-Hindu groups would gang together: Of course, they tie-up with Muslims, secularists, atheists, anti-Hindu groups etc., or they themselves create such web-missions with such names and attack Hindus by all means. Then, they would have MOU with non-Catholic evangelists of US and EURO countries with the respective Presidents agreeing with the Pope, the Head of Vatican City-State. As the anti-Hindu groups irrespective of their ideologies, gang together on stages in every meeting, seminar or conference, so also they join to attack.

 

The treatment of Hindu-men under Christian cyber-masters / employers: As the employers are Christians, they have already started pressure on Hindu IT workers and experts. Slowly, it would turn in different direction. When one young Indian software engineer went to US and working there, his fellow Americans used to ask him about the “sandal paste mark” on his forehead etc. Though, he used to give general explanation for their understanding, they used to argue with religious vigor. After some days, one of Americans gave him a Bible, asked to him to read and come for discussion. This is very similar to what has been happening in gulf-countries, where the sheik-masters used to try with Hindu-professionals.

 The treatment of Hindu-girs and women under Christian cyber-masters / employers: With Hindu girls and women, they behave differently. Starting with commenting on their mode of dress, colour etc., slowly, they praise about their beauty and so on. Of course, the Supreme Court judgment and direction about the treatment of women at work places applicable in India would not be applicable there and we do not know as to whether any equivalent Act, Rules or provisions are to check such “women teasing” [I do not want to use eve teasing, as they might take it as a right. Yes, as Jehovah teased Eve, the fundamentalist, fanatic Christians could think that it is their right to tease women following their Commandment of God].

 Infiltration into, manipulation of and hacking Internet groups: Some Hindu experts and professionals have been successful enough to bring out facts about Indian history, culture, tradition, heritage and civilization in internet. Reading such websites, many educated and learned students, scholars and even professors have been convinced about the logic and facts presented. After all, none could say other than what one generally accept to say “2 + 2 = 4”. Of course, mathematician experts, number theorists and analysts may disagree, that is healthy, intellectual and highly useful for humanity.

 Be careful about Carcinogenic Cyber Christians: Assessing the success or rather the impact, the Cyber-missions may all out to attack. So they start infiltrated with their cyber-expertise. As virus has been there affecting humanity, it has been there here also and we see the results. So we have to be careful about Carcinogenic Cyber Christians, who may be otherwise known as respectfully hackers and so on. The conversion of Indian civilization to Hindu civilization might be the reason for such cyber-invasion and infiltration.

 Hindus should not be just satisfied with Virtual pujas, Bajans, philosophy etc: Now, many Hindus are interested in Computers, Internet etc., because, they get wonderful-colourful pictures of Gods and Goddesses, Bajan-downloads, virtual pujas with all paraphernalia and so on.

 Of course, there are inter-religious skirmishes, philosophical debates with arrogance as usual, “I am modest treading middle-path or secular” type discussions. Here, over-zealous, pride and arrogant postings should be avoided, as the opponents may use such arguments against Hindus.

 Instead, they can discuss and debate about the rites, rituals and ceremonies conducted by them in different countries, how they differ, why divergence, why such differences are not made to India-criticizing scholars, etc., would be worthwhile.

 Hindus may get many e-mails regularly bombarding them to accept Christ for redemption. Of course from the desperate fundamentalist-fanatic categories, they may get threatening mails like “If you do not accept, you will go to hell” and so on. Of course, Hindus may get pornography also along with Jesus Christ or the Word of God with Satanic temptation! [I am not writing this with any wrong impression on Christians, with the past experience with Christians. My friends and I received hundreds of such letters, pamphlets and books from Christians, when Christian issues were discussed in Indian Express and other journals]. As time and space change, the tactics change but old-habits may not change.

 They may post some issues and divert or lead them to ticklish issues resulting in controversies. They may rehash the same old “Aryan-Dravidian”, anti-Brahmin like stuff. They may make personal attacks as a last resort. Or worst, they would accuse Hindus as “Hindutva-wadis”, “Saffron brigade”, “Hindu fundamentalists”, “Sanga parivar” and so on. Anyway, truth triumphs always.

 That is why I use to say often, we have to identify the Hindu-baiters, Hindu-enemies and Hindu-betrayers, expose them to all and treat them as such, as Hindu society cannot and could not produce or have such elements.

 Oh Hindus be ready.

kkVedaprakash <vedamvedaprakash@…>
To: hinducivilization@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2007 8:22:30 PM
Subject: [hc] Hindu Maya and Christian Cyber-missions, evangelism and Implications.

The so-called 300 / 3000 Ramayanas: The Dravidian propaganda

March 6, 2012

The so-called 300 / 3000 Ramayanas: The Dravidian propaganda

 By Sri Vedaprakash, March 16, 2008
 
Note: This topic is again and again brought to the notice of the readers. However, the atheists, the Dravidian propagandists, Communists, Christians and Muslims hiding under such banners again and again rake up the issue without reading Ramayana. Unfortunately, they even do not read what these Ramanujan, Paukla and others have written. Yet, they go on rehash the stuff. Therefore, I have to point out their hollowness to plant such mischievous postings appearing then and there.
Ramayana once again[1]!:Ever since the Sethu-Samuthram controversy has cropped up, the Dravidian ideologists, Karu’s Court Historians[2] and others ganged up together circulating the old-stories as authentic histories. Of course, the propaganda carried on by this hysterical gang has parallel only in Hitler’s camp. Of course, any reader can note it is the Black Parivar[3] and the Red Parivar[4] would very often take the Hitler-stick to beat others, but they do not realize that they have been following only Hitler. Coming to the point, now their main attack has been against Rama and Ramayana and therefore, the Karu’s Court historians started digging up old polemical writings, scurrilous pamphlets and anti-Hindu literature to serve their perverted purpose.

The “Viduthalai” [5] (March 14th and 13th dated), the DK-mouth piece, but with the blessings of Karu has brought out one brief of A. K. Ramanujam’s paper “Three Hundred Ramayanas”. T. R. Balu has made a visit and met Karu on 14th. Therefore, the coincidence can be noted and there would be raking up the issue again. The Communist super intelligent leaders have also started the nonsensical blabbering that Ramayana is myth and so on.

The Dravidian Love for Paula Richman: Recently, the Dravidian protagonists have again started their blasphemy against Sri Rama under the guise of historical research, analytical wisdom, Aryan-Dravidian race hypotheses[6] , their (Aryan-Dravidian) continuous struggle-for- ever in India and other ideologies. Incidentally, now, one way or the other, as they have drawn attention to Paula Richman’s book, “Many Ramayanas”, it is imperative to read what exactly, she mentions about the subject, which has been so fascinated to these atheist rabble-rousers. I have read the book carefully and particularly, the interpretations, many times to understand the psyche behind it. Actually, the whole story has not been new Indian scholars, researchers and at least, those who know about the origin of Ramayana[7]. A. K. Ramanujam’s paper[8] “Three Hundred Ramayanas” appears in “Many Ramayanas” of Paula Richman.

The book is nothing but compilation of articles of different personalities, purportly to look into the diversity of a narrative tradition in South Asia. Narrative, rendering, oral tradition, from oral to writing and vice versa, translation etc., can be entertained only literary criticism, when such liberality of literature is there in a society. Where, the thought process is control, such exercise cannot be undertaken. In fact, in many non-Indian societies, such narrative, rendering, oral tradition, from oral to writing and vice versa, translation etc., had been done away long back. Even today in the so-called modern, civilized, advanced, progressed, etc., times, such exercise is not possible in other non-Indian literature. Therefore, the literary critics should understand and appreciate the nuances, before criticizing the “many Ramayanas” or sending wrong signals.

Paula Richman has stories of A. K. Ramanujan, Frank E. Reynolds, Kathleen E. Erndl, David Shulman, Velcheru Narayan Rao, Clinton Seely, Staurt H. Blackburn, Paula Richman, Patricia Y. Mumme, Philip Lutgendorf, and Ramdas Lamb discuss about such narratives etc., and it appears as English rendering of any Tamil Pattimandram discussing the very old questions of mutilation of Surpanaka, Sita’s fire ordeal, etc. Unfortuinately, the sole aim of the compilation appears to deride, disparage and denigrate by choosing the topic under the guise research with historical camouflage.

300 or 3000 Ramayanas?: That there are “300 Ramayanas” as exactly counted has not been the original idea of A. K. Ramanujan, but, as he himself confessed that it belongs to one “student of Ramayana”, Canille Bulcke[9], who only counted so – exactly 300! Then to add his contribution, A. K. Ramanujan mentions[10] that according to a Kannada scholar[11] there are more than a thousand Ramayanas in Kannada! Then, adds that according to a Telugu scholar[12] there are more than a thousand Ramayanas in Telugu! At least, the Telugu scholar appears to be probably reasonable, as he said “more than a thousand”! It is not known why the learned scholar stops with, as he could have consulted Malayali scholar, Marathi scholar, Oriya scholar, Bengali scholar, Gujarathi scholar, Rajasthani scholar, Hindi scholar, Kashmiri scholar and so on.

So here, the point is that Ramayana story has been so popular among every society of the ancient civilizations and accepted by the members of different societies, each member wanted to recognize and transform such Ramayana character to the identified members of society or vice versa for exhibiting similar or same characteristics. When one asks, “Ey, why are you sleeping like Kumbakarna?” , it does not imply that his brother is like Ravana and so on. It has been used figuratively to drive out the point as such characterization has been known to everybody. Thus, he cannot be considered to have created one more Ramayana!

The so-called freedom of thought expression and opinion: The existence of 300 or 3,000 or 30,000 Ramayanas has been the credit to the popularity of Ramayana as a human-literature, Universal literature long back and it does not discredit as the existence of more Bibles[13] or Quarans or Korans[14], as the very mention would be anathema. Perhaps, the persons, who talk about “300 Ramayanas” do not know the existence of more Bibles or Korans., but the faithful believers destroyed many or all according to their own estimate and accounting and finally have one “printed version”, declared as infallible and revealed through God as the “Word of God”, so none could change anything thereafter. But they do not explain why there were hundreds of Bibles and Korans and why they were destroyed. How they could have selected the existing version only as the exact tract as revealed to their respective prophets to be accepted as authentic and authorized. How such divine grace had descended on the chosen group to decide and do accordingly.

Indians have not leaned the art of editing, expurging and interpolation of verses of books, as done by the non-Indians. They have not learned the art of destruction of earlier, differing or opposing versions and to claim that this is the only “Authorized version” or “Revealed Book”.

The Arabic tradition of rendering Poetry and Koran: The Arabic tradition has been that the Arabic poets would only recite their poems, be listened and enjoyed and appreciated by others and they were never written down. Particularly, in the case of Koran, it was strongly believed that as it was revealed by Allah through Jibreal / Gabriel to the Prophet Mohammed (PBCH), it has to be learned by heart by listening to the recital by the experts. There had / have been groups exclusively for the purpose of recital of Koran. Only later, the writing down of Koran and its translation into other non-Arabic languages started. As Ibn Warraq has elaborately dealt with about it, it is not discussed here. In fact, Mohammed Mamaduke Picthall[15] in his foreword clearly records the following points:

1.. It may be reasonably claimed that no Holy Scriptures can be fairly presented by one who disbelieves its inspiration and its message.
2.. The Koran cannot be translated. That is the belief of old-fashioned sheikhs and the view of the present writer (H. M. Pitchall).
3.. …the Glorious Koran, that inimitable symphony, the very sounds of which move men to tears and ecstasy.

In India, the society has been liberal, democratic and egalitarian, so the members have liberty to pursue their literary pursuits. Thus, they make one God to many Gods; make male and female Gods with child God also; many times lover; employer and slave; chieftain, king and emperor and so on. It increases his thinking and creativity. The painter and sculptors too follow such pattern and depict Gods and Goddesses accordingly. This is the real freedom of thought, expression, and exhibition of artistic talent. That is why the negative characterization is opposed and condemned. Nowadays, it has become fashion for elite artists, eminent historians and social activists to come out and support such errant perverts, but it is not correct, as could be seen. For example, A cannot of sleeping with B’s wife, just because, he has the freedom of thinking. Having such freedom of thinking, he cannot express openly to B, because he has freedom of expression. As B too have such rights and starts exercise his rights of freedom of thought and expression the consequences are well known. Therefore, there are individual rights which should not violate the rights of others. If this fundamental is not known or knowingly, continuously violated, definitely the peaceful people may react one day. Therefore, it is better to live amicably instead of provoking others. In such situations and conditions, only the provoking forces are barbaric, medieval, lumpen and so on.

Any other world literature does not have such elasticity, flexibility, liberality, democracy, egalitarianism proves that they are controlled and suppressed. Therefore, there cannot be any freedom of thought, expression and opinion entertained in such societies. Even, there is no freedom to tell the fact that there were 300 / 3000 Bibles and Korans, but they were destroyed and now there is only one! Here, Salman Rusdie and H. F. Hussain can be contrasted in the context; Ibn Warraq and EVR; Karunanidhi and Taslima Nasreen; Bertrand Russell and Thomas Paine; and so on.

Ramayana characters could be human beings of any age: As mentioned, because of the flexibility of the characterization of Ramayana, it is applicable to any time and place. Ramayana and Mahabharata are played everywhere by the people with their available men and materials. Therefore, in such depiction, dramatization and adapted-rendering, there would variance in all aspects. Taking these literary critics cannot make big fuss out of it. Now Rama and Ravana may come with pants and shirts also. If it becomes, popular, it would be carried on enjoyed by a group. Can it we say, it is 301th Ramayana or 3001th? Yes, it is correct, “as long as there are many Ramas, there would be more Ramayanas”.

But no other literature could be subjected to such process, as in the non-Indian tradition, the very such thought might be unthinkable. We cannot have many non-Indian heroes or Gods. Can Paula Richman produce an edition of “Many Bibles”, “Many Qurans”, like that or any narratives and oral traditions of Jesus, Mary, Joseph, Mohammed, Fatima etc.(just for example, it is asked). Believers of the respective lands and countries know the existence of such narratives, renderings and oral traditions available here and there, but Paula cannot compile. Why even the New Testament apocrypha or Hadis renderings are not discussed, debated and papers presented.

Who can analyze the non-Indian characters (including heroes and heroines, deified heroes and heroines and Gods and Goddesses themselves), criticize or justify their acts of omission or commission, and bring all renderings along with Thomas Paine, Robert Ingersol, Salmon Rushdie, Taslima Nasreen etc. Even Tembavani[16] and Sirappuranam[ 17] cannot be rendered in English, as the orthodox might oppose some verses. In fact, they had already objected to “Kesadhipada varnanai” (= the Tamil traditional narrative of a woman character whoever may be from head to feet, part by part) and removed such verses. Therefore, without going into the details, the western scholars go on commit blunders under the guise of research and it is totally wrong. They should ponder over. As they have big-big University labels, our Dravidian friends immediately, take their renderings and they produce their own renderings to blaspheme Hindus. Here only, the problem comes.

SUN-TV and Ramayana: In SUN-TV group of companies, Karunanidhi and his family members have shares. So why SUN-TV all of sudden start broadcasting “Ramayana”, that too, the much hated, criticized and blasphemed one. Why not the “Ravana Kaviyam” of Kulandai? It is promoted, looked. Loved and considered as “divine” by the Dravidian protagonists including Karnanidhi. He has already accepted that he supports Ravana and he belongs to such clan! Of course, even Kalainjar TV cannot be prevented in broadcasting Ramayana or Mahabhrata, but what about the ideology? They cannot abuse Hindus and cater them with this tamasha. They cannot kill Hindu culture and do this nonsense. They cannot soil the sanctity of temples and try to do some gimmicks. Of course, we know they do not follow the dictum of “Padippathu Ramayanam, idippathu Pillaiyar koil”, but, they meddle with Ramayana and demolish the Temple of Ramayana. That is why now the target is Ramar-palam!

References

[1] Today when I started typing this, SUN-TV of the Black Parivar has started broadcasting “Ramayana”! Even Kalainjar TV broadcast Ramayana!

[2] Vedaprakash, Why Tamilnadu Historians tell lies?, http://www.indiainteracts. com

[3] DK-DMK-PMK-Viduthal ai Puligar, their affiliated parties, associations and ideological subsidiaries.

[4] Al Communists parties CPI-CPI(M), CPI (ML) their affiliated parties, associations and ideological subsidiaries.

[5] It is only summarized one, of course with abusive language used characteristically in the Tamil translation.

[6] In spite of the fact that the Aryan-Dravidian hypotheses and Aryan Invasion Theory (AIT) have been proved unhistorical and baseless, these ideologists continue to believe and carry on the propaganda and rouse passion in the same language as they used to speak some 40 to 60 years back.

[7] In the Journals of Royal Asiatic society, All India Oriental Conference and others, enough has been discussed and debated about Valmiki Ramayana and the Jain and Buddhist version of their Ramayanas.

[8] A. K. Ramanujam, “Three Hundred Ramayanas”, Many Ramayanas, edited by Paula Richman, 1991, University of California Press, USA, pp.22-49.

[9] A. K. Ramanujam, opt.cit, p.24.

[10] Ibid, however, he does not mention the name of the Kannada scholar who could count exactly 1000!

[11] This “According to….” makes one remember, “The Gospel according to St. Matthew”, “The Gospel according to St. Mark”, “The Gospel according to St. Luke”, “The Gospel according to St. John”, and so on!

[12] Ibid, here also, he does not mention the name of the Telugu scholar who could count more than 1000!

[13] H. G. G. Herklots, How the Bible Came to us?, Penguin Books, UK, 1959.

[14] Ibn Warraq, Why I am not a Muslim, Promethecus Books, New York, 1995, p.20, 73-76.

[15] Mohammed Mamaduke Picthall, The Meaning of the holy Quran, Crescent Publishing Company , New Delhi,

[16] A Tamil literary work produced on the lines of or rather imitating Kamba Ramayanam.

[17] A Tamil literary work produced on the lines of or rather imitating Kamba Ramayanam, but some Mohammedans claim that it is even superior to Kamba Ramayana, of course, they do not talk about the editing, expunction and removal verses and other modifications done.

Romila Thapar, Duke University, Methodist Church or Romila Thapar, Secularism, Secular history: The Role of Historian and Social Change!

July 16, 2009
Romila Thapar, Duke University, Methodist Church or Romila Thapar, Secularism, Secular history: The Role of Historian and Social Change!
Published on October 23rd, 2007 In Uncategorized, Politics |  Views 410
Romila Thapar, Duke University, Methodist Church orRomila Thapar, Secularism, Secular history: The Role of Historian and Social Change! I am happy to know that, “The Historian in the World: A Conversation with John Hope Franklin and Romila Thapar” will take place at 3 p.m. in the Divinity School’s Goodson Chapel on Duke’s West Campus. It is free and open to the public. Srinivas Aravamudan, director of the John Hope Franklin Humanities Institute, will moderate the discussion”. http://www.dukenews .duke.edu/ 2007/10/conversa tion.htmlI am more anxious what the historians discuss there in the Divinity School’s Goodson Chapel on Duke’s West Campus on October 22, 2007!

“the DivinitySchool’s Goodson Chapel on Duke’s West Campus” made me curious to look into the details. The University claims that, “The Duke University is related the Methodist Church”.

For details see: “Duke University”s Relation to the Methodist Church”:  http://library.duke.edu/uarchives/history/duke-umchh.html

  •      Well, it is all right, bt how the reportedly Communist or Marxist, progressive, secuar Romila Thapar would be speaking there in the, “the Divinity School’s Goodson Chapel on Duke’s West Campus”?
  •      How “Two distinguished scholars will share their views of the role of the historian and social change”?
  •      Would they discuss within the Charter, bylaws, aims, and mission statement” or they go beyond?

The “Charter, bylaws, aims, and mission statement” contains a provision, as follows:

The aims of Duke University are to assert a faith in the eternal union of knowledge and religion set forth in the teachings and character of Jesus Christ, the Son of God; to advance learning in all lines of truth; to defend scholarship against all false notions and ideals; to develop a Christian love of freedom and truth; to promote a sincere spirit of tolerance; to discourage all partisan and sectarian strife; and to render the largest permanent service to the individual, the state, the nation, and the church. Unto these ends shall the affairs of this University always be administered”.http://library.duke.edu/uarchives/history/charterlink.html

How Ropmila Thapar hailing from “Secular India” is going to be accommodative, conducive and recptive to such Christians principles in the name of Jesus Christ? This makes me remember as to how the Christian Crusades, marriages and other functions are held at the “Periyar Tidal” (auditourium with big hall) at Chennai, India. The podium / stage there bear the Cross-believing Christians and the atheists, who speak against the God, scriptures and believers! Like that, would the “the Divinity School’s Goodson Chapel on Duke’s West Campus” bear the secular, progressive and sectarian Romila Thapar there in the name of Jesus Christ, the Son of God?

Just remember, what she wrote about Jesus Christ, when she was accusing Rama, the Hindu God as a myth:

This does not happen with the biographies of those who were known to be historical figures and who founded belief systems: the Buddha, Jesus Christ, Mohammad. Their biographies adhere largely to a single story-line and this helps to endorse the ‘official’ narrative of their life. Their existence is recorded in other sources as well that are not just narratives of their lives but have diverse associations…..”.

At that time, I had responded as follows:

Their biographies adhere largely to a single story-line and this helps to endorse the ‘official’ narrative of their life.Why they should largely adhere to a single line? How this helps “official” narrative? How “official” it could be of “their life”? Why can’t you write as a historian instead of believer here? That the “biographers” were compelled or forced to accept or adhere to a single line proves that many lines were left out. And still small number of biographers who did not adhere to a single line is also exposed. Then, what you are talking about? Majority view and minority view? Condemn the “lesser” and accept or approve the Larger”! Adhere to one-line and forget many lines! What sort of historian you are? That man Karu has become a senile man and talks differently. Do you also do the same think as a senile lady?How you endorse such one-liners? Is there any historical methodology to that effect? Which University teaches such approving of one-line biography by eminent historians like you?Do not fool Indians. Ernest Renan, J. M. Robertson and so many reputed authorities are there on the subject matter of Jesus Christ and Christianity. Any way, it is your cowardice gets exposed, as you never whispered anything, when there was much Christian opposition to screening of “Da Vinci Code”. However, when the so-called “Hindutva judgment” came out, you vociferously jumped and asserted that “We would go to Court”. Everything appeared in “the Hindu” itself with your face. Madam, what happened? But now you come siding with atheists, anti-Hindus, anti-nationals as a historian suppressing the recent past and forgetting your own past!

Their existence is recorded in other sources as well that are not just narratives of their lives but have diverse associations. So also Rama. Why then your argument goes differently.In fact, their associations differ. But, Ramayana core story, as H. D. Sankalia in his “Ramayana Myth or Reality”  that it had been there nearly for 3000 years.How “That their existences is recorded in other sources” help you to decide?

It may be noted that historians and scholars have pointed out that Christ story was copied from
Krishna! Rama was repeatedly mentioned in different literature not because of variance, but influence and impact created on the people well before 2500-3000 YBP. Was the Sangam poet a fool to record in his poem about his discussion with his army about the mode of crossing over the ocean to Lanka”. How that poet was imaging that that Lanka should have been the Lanka of Ramayana in his times i.e, 2500 – 3000 YBP?”

Definitely, the Americans and American Christian believers might be knowing about the background and the implications revoving around the discussion. So, we Indians are eagerly waiting to see as to how tshe is going to discuss within the conditions of the University and Christian belief system or she would have courage to vent our her genuine feeling as sjhe has been doing here in India against Hindus. As she has recently started supporting the atheist political party DK-DMK-PMK combine of the ruling combine (supported by the Communist-Marxist political parties from outside), we look forward the discussion to fulfil the following conditions:

The aims of Duke University are to assert a faith in the eternal union of knowledge and religion set forth in the teachings and character of Jesus Christ, the Son of God; V     to advance learning in all lines of truth; to defend scholarship against all false notions and ideals; to develop a Christian love of freedom and truth; V     to promote a sincere spirit of tolerance; to discourage all partisan and sectarian strife; and V     to render the largest permanent service to the individual, the state, the nation, and the church.

Unto these ends shall the affairs of this University always be administered

The activities of Duke foundation have been obviously Christian:

For details: click and see http://www.dukeendowment.org/ruralchurch

VEDAPRAKASH

22-10-2007.